Another crash video to critique

[S Smith]

After watching it and making your assessment, here is a link to an article with an interview with the rider. (What was flying through the air that almost hit the other rider?)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZAO9mC_9fE#

 

[seagiant]

Hi,
      Thanks for the vid! :great:

Admittedly, I'm trying to figure whey he crashed? :-[

Looks like he lost control of the handle bars/front tire?

 

[acisroc]

The driver in the truck threw out a lit cigarette?

  That is my story officer and I am sticking to it.

 

[Undertaker]

Clicking frame to frame, looks like the rear tire got out from under him, got out of line, and a resulted in a tank-slapper high side!

That had to hurt the next morning! :'(

 

[MizzouMike]

Not sure how the crash happened, but according to the Lat/Lon on the video, it was west of Hartford, CT.  Kind of neat to have the lat/lon on there, wonder who or why that had that info???  LEO?  Very interesting

 

[S Smith]

Not sure how the crash happened, but according to the Lat/Lon on the video, it was west of Hartford, CT.  Kind of neat to have the lat/lon on there, wonder who or why that had that info???  LEO?  Very interesting

It happened on RT 72 in Harwinton (30 min west of Hartford, 30 min north of Waterbury - I've ridden this road many times). The vehicle with the cM was not LEO.  Several of the new consumer dash cams (like the Garmin unit) have GPS for tracking lat/Lon on the recording.

 

[seagiant]

Hi,
      Well to me it looks like the rear comes around because he lost control on the front slowing it down, and then the rear tried to out run it! ;D

Admittedly, I try to learn from these things, but see people do stuff on bikes I really can't understand!!! :-[

I'm sure with these new high powered bikes that "to much bike for the rider" rears it's ugly head on occasion! :

 

[Dan4aspen]

Just a thought, but we all know painted lines can be dangerously slick.  As he was going to pass 3 cars, first being the one recording.  Wonder if when he accelerated to pass,  back tire started to wash from lack of traction on paint?  At least he owned it! 

 

[daemon]

The article days that he was attempting to pass 3 card on a bike he recently purchased on a road with excessive bumpiness....

Still I have to say. To much available throttle for an inexperienced biker.
Just my opinion.
I've had my Z1000 for 10 knock on wood years.
Nary a scratch on it from excessive throttle use

 

[louSpag]

I word "inexperienced". He head clear lane, clear line of sight, and at that speed the painted line should not have contributed to his misfortune. That's my opinion.

LouSpag

 

[2linby]

Isn't it obvious?  :-\  He ran out of skill!    :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

 

[acisroc]

+1^^^^^ :rotflmao:



  2linby is cool  :great: :great: :great: 

 

[Clayton600]

i never would have guessed what caused it by just watching the video, but after reading the story it makes sense.

few years back i was riding rt 33 west coming into Elkins WV , cruising off last mountain onto the straight road i put my left hand on my left leg and relaxed, it was then i ran over a small line of pot holes, i seen it coming and didn't even swerve to try and miss them, but one of them was quite deep and it made my body position move and i inadvertently pulled the throttle which threw me back and pulling the throttle more and pulled bars to the right caused a small wobble, fortunately i was going slow and my left hand had not planted on the grip yet, when i let go of the throttle the wobble stopped. Got my heart pumping that's for sure. close call.

 

[sas mayhem]

Just a thought, but we all know painted lines can be dangerously slick.  As he was going to pass 3 cars, first being the one recording.  Wonder if when he accelerated to pass,  back tire started to wash from lack of traction on paint?  At least he owned it!

+1, the rider seemed to be losing it, before he got into view.

Cheers
Ron

 

[seagiant]

Hi,
        IMO,  he lost it from the front with the handlebars! :motonoises:

Whether from bumps in the road or not paying attention!

A lesson there for us all,  I'm sure! ;D

 

[smithr]

My guess from the first few frames is that he went wide when he started the pass and caught some gravel on the side of the road and then over compensation tossed his cookies from there.

 

[mnbikeguy]

If you go back to :03 of the video you'll see what looks to be a nice fat tar snake. I bet he hit that and was already out of control by the time he comes into the frame around :05.

 

[bobct]

He did look like he took it pretty wide on the pass coupled with acceleration for the 3car pass I bet he hit a little sand or a tar snake going wide under acceleration he lost rear traction on a otherwise sedate looking straightaway.

Lesson learned?, don't pass 3 cars on a double yellow line road, don't get too hard on the throttle until you establish your intended path.

Interesting comment about the one handed front end wobble caused by pot holes then inadvertently twisting the throttle, food for thought.

 

[gpink]

Hard on the throttle...rear hit a bump and lost contact with the road causing the engine and rear wheel to rev...touched back down and the rear tried to pass the front....rider panicked and grabbed a handfull of front brake....?

 

[Thud300]

Rear wheel spun out on something, didn't look like a tar snake but some kind of oily stain on the pavement...? Way too much toy for the boy

 

[willyp]

Any speculation drawn from the video is just that... speculation. In the article, the rider seems to be blaming it on the bumpiness of the road. I don't see anything in the video to refute that.

 

[S Smith]

Any speculation drawn from the video is just that... speculation. In the article, the rider seems to be blaming it on the bumpiness of the road. I don't see anything in the video to refute that.

Why didn't you also mention the apparently excessive speed and illegally passing 3 vehicles?  This is also shown in the video and stated by the rider, “So this was me passing 3 cars on a bumpy a$$ road last Friday on I bike that I owned for 1 week...”

 

[seagiant]

Hi,
      I remember the old KZ 1000 in the 80's put quite a few people on a gurney! :-[

Now you have the Z 1000 with even more power!

You still have to supply the brains, even with all the "safety" features built in! ;D

 

[mattchewn]

Hi,
      I remember the old KZ 1000 in the 80's put quite a few people on a gurney! :-[

Now you have the Z 1000 with even more power!

You still have to supply the brains, even with all the "safety" features built in! ;D

Hey there,
NO WHERE in my manual(s) does it say anything about supplying brains. 
They failed to mention anything about that at the dealer either!!! 
I guess I'll have to ride without them after all!!  :motonoises: :motonoises: :motonoises:



Matt

 

[willyp]

Any speculation drawn from the video is just that... speculation. In the article, the rider seems to be blaming it on the bumpiness of the road. I don't see anything in the video to refute that.

Why didn't you also mention the apparently excessive speed and illegally passing 3 vehicles?  This is also shown in the video and stated by the rider, “So this was me passing 3 cars on a bumpy a$$ road last Friday on I bike that I owned for 1 week...”

I'm not sure how that's relevant to what I said, but, no, he didn't blame the crash on speed or passing three cars illegally.

 

[S Smith]

Any speculation drawn from the video is just that... speculation. In the article, the rider seems to be blaming it on the bumpiness of the road. I don't see anything in the video to refute that.

Why didn't you also mention the apparently excessive speed and illegally passing 3 vehicles?  This is also shown in the video and stated by the rider, “So this was me passing 3 cars on a bumpy a$$ road last Friday on I bike that I owned for 1 week...”

I'm not sure how that's relevant to what I said, but, no, he didn't blame the crash on speed or passing three cars illegally.

I feel the relevance is that there is info that can be drawn from the video that is not speculation. 

 

[willyp]

Like what? Passing three cars illegally isn't what caused the crash. Him saying it's him passing cars on a bumpy a$$ road didn't cause the crash either.

If that's what you're implying... you're speculating.

 

[S Smith]

Like what? Passing three cars illegally isn't what caused the crash. Him saying it's him passing cars on a bumpy a$$ road didn't cause the crash either.

If that's what you're implying... you're speculating.

There is rarely one factor that leads to a crash.  And no.... Not speculation... Plausible conjecture based on having ridden this road numerous times and my experience as motorcycle safety professional.

 

[willyp]

And no.... Not speculation... Plausible conjecture

:-[

:rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

based on having ridden this road numerous times and my experience as motorcycle safety professional.

An opinion based on your experience isn't something shown in the video. And is still conjecture. Which is another word for speculation. Plausible or not. 

 

[mattchewn]

Saw that coming.....

Nicely played Willy,

Steve?  Your turn!  :nananana:

) ) )


Matt

 

[willyp]

 

[S Smith]

Saw that coming.....

Nicely played Willy,

Steve?  Your turn!  :nananana:

) ) )


Matt

Nah! I'm done

 

[Knoxswift]

I wonder if K-Trac would of helped in this situation?

 

[seagiant]

Hi,
        Ok, wow, now I figured it out! :-[

He crashed because he was running Bridgestone BT-021's on the bike! :great: > > >

Right Matt! ;D

 

[Scary Harry]

Using software I downloaded from the Internet, I ran the video through a process similar to what NASA uses to analyze pictures from Pluto.
What I see by looking into the truck's side view mirror, is the reflection of what actually happened to the rider.  Even though the rider is using head and eye protection, a big nasty bumble bee flew into the rider's face, specifically, up his right nostril and lodged half way up into his head. Needless to say, that would be distracting enough to lose control under the best conditions.

I'm going to start wearing nose plugs from now on.

 

[acisroc]

WOW Harry Martin is cool  :great: :great: :great:

  You got some nice downloads there!! Mystery solved


We Have A Winner!! Ding  Ding Ding :1rij: :08: :06: :singing:

 

[norm9688]

I think he had a big case of dumbassadrossis,  I hear there is a shot for that now.... :-\ :-[ :rotflmao:

 

[Thud300]

Looks like the crash victim's visor is the object flying through the air...

So this is a ride-by-wire bike, on a bumpy road, and he grabbed a big handful of throttle...

Ok, this is total speculation, but could the ECU have chopped the throttle when the rear wheel lost contact with the road and free spun in the air? Then the rear skidded out due to engine braking? 

 

[zarticus]

Looks like the crash victim's visor is the object flying through the air...

So this is a ride-by-wire bike, on a bumpy road, and he grabbed a big handful of throttle...

Ok, this is total speculation, but could the ECU have chopped the throttle when the rear wheel lost contact with the road and free spun in the air? Then the rear skidded out due to engine braking?

No, It's Plausible conjecture  :rotflmao:

 

[ChipDoc]

I think he had a big case of dumbassadrossis,  I hear there is a shot for that now.... :-\ :-[ :rotflmao:

Really?  You mean they actually CAN cure stupid now?  The wonders of modern medicine!  :great:

 

[gpink]

I think he had a big case of dumbassadrossis,  I hear there is a shot for that now.... :-\ :-[ :rotflmao:

Really?  You mean they actually CAN cure stupid now?  The wonders of modern medicine!  :great:

Yes, you can....

 

[2linby]

Isn't it obvious?  :-\  He ran out of skill!    :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

I can only speculate,  infer,  deem, determine, ascertain,  ponder, question what happened. However regardless I have to stick to the above quote.

 

[joblo1978]

Passing 3 cars we can bet he was hard on the throttle.  I'm surprised no one has mentioned head shake yet?

Could have gotten some and freaked out.

 

[lrbuck]

All the comments about this crash are good. But the risk the rider took exceeded his skill level.

In the new MSF-BRC, a lot of time is spent by the students analyzing Risk. Each rider is encouraged to honestly self-assess their Skills and attitudes concerning Risk. We use a term "Risk Offset", which is noted on a chart that the student completes, and another chart which the student revisits several times throughout the course. The rider's goal is to always have their Skills exceed the Risks they may take. To do this requires continuous reflection and honest, self-assessment.

If you have friends that are riding without a Motorcycle Endorsement, I urge you to have them take the new, MSF, Basic Rider Course, which includes the new range exercises. The new classroom sessions and range exercises are much more in-depth than the Legacy course. The Range Exercises are much better for "real world" skill development. Yes, it's a tougher course, but riders will be better prepared with riding skills and the skills for managing Risk. BTW, not all states offer the full course yet. Some are using the new classroom material, but continue with the Legacy range exercises. Most will be adopting the new range exercises this year and in 2016.

Ride safe...and well

 

[dimmwitt89@hotmail.com]

I'll go with something similar to aviation incident reports:  Rider failed to maintain stability and directional control of vehicle.

 

[willyp]

I'd say that pretty much covers it.

 

[alekkas]

Here's a different take:  They're flying, having fun.  Get out there to make the big pass.  Ran out of confidence with the curve coming on, so locked up the rear trying to slot in ahead of the video car.  Rear locks up, he freaks out, then we see the rest. 

I don't buy the bumpy road.  MAYBE the little strip of pot holes on the very left of the pavement, but he was clearly in the middle of that lane.  Ran out of confidence, then out of skill.  Bigger, faster motor woulda had it  :nananana: