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Oil Leak - Cam Sensor Issue?
- Thread starter Bamm Bamm
- Start date
Just to land myself please confirm the below:
The ECS is located on the top center of the head and above / between exhaust headers 2 and 3.
This leak you have (from initial view and angle) appears to be very left centric. Once you get a clearer view it will be obvious but (if the answer to 1,2,3 above is yes) my initial thought is a head cover gasket (most folks refer to this as the valve cover gasket). There was a head design change in later years but earlier C14’s have a history of developing leaks at the front left corner of the head cover due to poor oil drainage.
There could be a small chance of other origins but that is the most likely case.
Wayne, Carol & Blue
- The circled is the coolant reservoir hose, in other words the front left corner of the engine?
- Is that an oil drip having pooled on the hose or picture quality?
- Does it leak considerably more when on the side stand and idling?
- Are you having to add oil?
The ECS is located on the top center of the head and above / between exhaust headers 2 and 3.
This leak you have (from initial view and angle) appears to be very left centric. Once you get a clearer view it will be obvious but (if the answer to 1,2,3 above is yes) my initial thought is a head cover gasket (most folks refer to this as the valve cover gasket). There was a head design change in later years but earlier C14’s have a history of developing leaks at the front left corner of the head cover due to poor oil drainage.
There could be a small chance of other origins but that is the most likely case.
Wayne, Carol & Blue
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1. It is the left front corner. That shot is through the fairing, which is coming off today for a better look.
2. Something is indeed pooled on that hose, and it has the texture of oil.
3. I haven't check it from an idle, but it only seems to leak after I park it after a ride, and yes, when it's on the sidestand. I took a 50-mile ride, and when it sat, there was a pretty noticeable puddle of oil. After riding it back home, it did it again. Added about an eighth of a quart with it on the center stand. The drip appears to be running down to, or coming from, the bottom of the drain plug. I changed the oil last week, so after an oil filter change and a new crush washer for the drain plug, it still had the drip. The oil puddle is directly under the drain plug.
4. At this time, I have not had to add a substantial amount of oil.
Thanks for the follow-up questions. I did order the ECS O-rings from Murph's just in case, but I did also just see the whole thing about the head cover gasket. Ugh.
@Bamm Bamm what is the model year?
2015 Kawasaki redesigned the head allowing better oil drainage.
When was last valve check? If leaking from this head cover gasket you are going to need get a full kit of replacement soft parts - Murphs the best bet there. And you might as well do the valve check at the same time you have the head cover off.
Wayne, Carol & Blue
This is a true statement ^^^ but Kawasaki increased the washer thickness years ago. So yes on old style, no on new style as that would be too much squish. I don't remember exactly when they did that but I do remember measuring both and there was a significant difference.
So I think I may very well have two problems, so I'll go with the easy one first.
There is a slight drip coming from the drain plug, even when torquing it to 22 lb/ft. Changed the washer, and there's still a slight drip. You can see it forming underneath, so I'm thinking the first problem may be underneath since that's where I'm seeing the oil. Should I switch to a nylon washer?
As for the picture above, that might be valve cover-related, but I'm not really smelling oil on startup or seeing smoke. So I'm going to take the fairing off and see if that's really oil.
Thanks for the help and the eyes!
There is a slight drip coming from the drain plug, even when torquing it to 22 lb/ft. Changed the washer, and there's still a slight drip. You can see it forming underneath, so I'm thinking the first problem may be underneath since that's where I'm seeing the oil. Should I switch to a nylon washer?
As for the picture above, that might be valve cover-related, but I'm not really smelling oil on startup or seeing smoke. So I'm going to take the fairing off and see if that's really oil.
Thanks for the help and the eyes!
If you are uncertain then yes good approach to stop, identify what is leaking up at the cover area. About not smelling any oil or smoke, where that potential oil is leaking at may be skirting the #1 header, sure look likes that.
As mentioned earlier coolant has a very distinct smell.
Any chance you have a damaged or crud impregnated sealing surface on the plug or oil pan drain hole? What direction does your oil plug face: down or forward?
Wayne, Carol & Blue
I got a 2012, so it's forward. For that issue, I'm tempted to just drain the oil into a clean pan (it's barely two weeks old), give that drain plug itself and that area a good cleaning (or buy a new drain plug from Advance), put on a new washer (I'll do the aluminum one first), and monitor. Then I'll focus on whatever that is up top.
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2012 still had the poor head draining which frequently leads to an oil leak in the Cylinder 1 Left / Front area.
You’re obviously not going to swap a head so the mitigation is replacing the gasket (if that is where you got a leak).
Fred mentioned earlier about a washer to put on the head cover bolts to get some extra length and squish on the head cover. I’ve never tried that method, always just replace and hey while we’re at it, it’s time (or overdue) for a valve check.
Wayne, Carol & Blue
You’re obviously not going to swap a head so the mitigation is replacing the gasket (if that is where you got a leak).
Fred mentioned earlier about a washer to put on the head cover bolts to get some extra length and squish on the head cover. I’ve never tried that method, always just replace and hey while we’re at it, it’s time (or overdue) for a valve check.
Wayne, Carol & Blue
Replace the cam sensor o-ring with the larger one from "Murphs." That should do the trick...If not, replace the valve cover gasket and use 0.5mm ss washers to increase the bite on the valve cover gasket. Be careful to not over torque the bolts...Sean
Oil pools on the left side of the head when the engine is shut down, and it slow leaks out the gasket, and sometimes around the exhaust cam position sensor, but mostly it's the valve cover that leaks. I've never seen any of the leaks on 2015 and later bikes like I do on the early model years. Just did a valve job on a 2016 this week and it was dry as a bone.
I always replace the valve cover gaskets, head hole gaskets, and valve cover bolt seals on every bike I do. I also replace the exhaust cam sensor O ring with a slightly oversize on. I've never had one leak afterwards. (Murphs sells the whole seal kit.)
I always replace the valve cover gaskets, head hole gaskets, and valve cover bolt seals on every bike I do. I also replace the exhaust cam sensor O ring with a slightly oversize on. I've never had one leak afterwards. (Murphs sells the whole seal kit.)
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So far, so good on my 2009. I did replace the cam sensor o-ring years ago. No issues thus far Fred. You are correct, mama Kawi upgraded the head for better oil drainage in 2015...Sean
Normally, when I pull the valve cover off on a 08-2014 I find a pool of oil at the left corner. On the newer bikes, they are always dry there with no more pooled oil.
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Slow night
The kit includes the stock cam seal o ring as well as the over size one ( MOB o ring)
We added the fuel filter option because its a great time to go ahead and service it
Murph
I.wonder if there's a way to modifying the older heads to the new er style by drilling the head. Is.it just something simple to drill to a return galley orifice? Or is extensive machining required?
I need to do more research into the changes on the head design in 2015. I'm not 100% sure what was done at this point and I could be wrong about the drain back hole, so I edited my previous posts. I'll try to find out more info.
2010 Head Part Number
2015 Head Part Number
By the way, there was also a change to the shorter valve cover bolts. I'm not sure exactly what year they changed, or how, but my guess is that they reduced the length of the shoulder on them so that they provide more squeeze to the gaskets. They also changed the O ring on the cam position sensors.
Valve cover bolt change
New O ring Part Number for cam position sensors
2010 Head Part Number
2015 Head Part Number
By the way, there was also a change to the shorter valve cover bolts. I'm not sure exactly what year they changed, or how, but my guess is that they reduced the length of the shoulder on them so that they provide more squeeze to the gaskets. They also changed the O ring on the cam position sensors.
Valve cover bolt change
New O ring Part Number for cam position sensors
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Rats, I just ordered those from you! lol Ah well, will keep the extras handy in case someone else needs it.
Slow night
The kit includes the stock cam seal o ring as well as the over size one ( MOB o ring)
We added the fuel filter option because its a great time to go ahead and service it
Murph
lol Smart thinking!Bamm Bamm I kinda think people need, three or four of them myself..
A missileer?
And yes, I was a crew dog. That's where my road name came from.
Those 6 x18 bolts are for the air port lids. The 6 x 22.5 shoulder bolts have not changed. The exception of the shoulder bolts is the shorter of the 2 long valve cover bolts has changed in some manner.
They changed the thickness of the washer (oring they call it) under the shoulder bolts in 2010. Don't buy the 08 or 09 part number.
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I haven't taken the radiator off, but this is looking from the right trying to aim between cylinders 2 and 3. And there's definitely SOMETHING built up in there, which I'm presuming to be oil and not road grime, so I'll start with the cam sensor (waiting for the O-rings to get here), degrease/clean that area, check/replace the washer on the oil pan (M12 aluminum crush washers, right), clean the drain plug and the drain area on the pan, and close it all back up.
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You are correct, I was looking at the wrong part on the fiche, the shorter valve cover bolts haven't changed.
And of course the stripped out part will be the oil pan threads…
Replacing the sump is not terrible but it is rather expensive, even if you find a pan online cheap all around gaskets (exhaust and pan) and orings add up quickly but are necessary to be replaced after separating.
Wayne, Carol & Blue
Another thing that changed that I just remembered, is the well hole gaskets at the spark plug holes, they got thinner in conjunction with the gaskets under the shoulder bolts getting thicker. You can't order the old part number, but you can order the old shoulder bolt gaskets. That could change if you put them in the cart.