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reason #213 for wearing gloves
- Thread starter Stevewfl
- Start date
ChipDoc
Sport Tourer
I wouldn't want to be at his house for the next week or three. When Mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy. :-[
I also notice he's got Florida plates. This is what happens when you normally ride 11 curves in 318 miles and then go try to conquer the Dragon. Folks like this (and I'm one of them) should try to SURVIVE the Dragon before they try conquering it.
I also notice he's got Florida plates. This is what happens when you normally ride 11 curves in 318 miles and then go try to conquer the Dragon. Folks like this (and I'm one of them) should try to SURVIVE the Dragon before they try conquering it.
ChipDoc said:
+1 I agree about surviving it first!
Although i ride all over USA, Florida has some of the best curves in the country. Daytona, JenningsGP, Homestead-Miami International, Moroso and a few more. Come join us for track days any time, Jennings is uber-cheap but the wall at Daytona is fun for a bucket list item
Sport rider
Iron Butt
ChipDoc said:
You beat me to it Chip! :-[
ConcoursKZ
Sport Tourer
In the picture it looks like someone blew grass and debris into the road. Once that big bike running two up started to go there was little chance of saving it. I wonder if he broke his leg and where the bike ended up.
Sport Rider said:
Although i ride all over USA, Florida has some of the best curves in the country. Daytona, JenningsGP, Homestead-Miami International, Moroso and a few more. Come join us for track days any time, Jennings is uber-cheap but the wall at Daytona is fun for a bucket list item
Looks like it was dragging for a number of feet (see the two scrape marks in the road, and the sparks in the pic), but it's pretty much stopped here (everything's equally in focus, he's clearly pushing UP on the bike, her entire forearm is on the ground like she's lifting herself up). Plus it's low-sided here, so not enough momentum left to flip over.
At least I HOPE that's what I see. I think alikkon nailed it- he clipped an inside corner (rode down it and up/out) bringing the grass with him, and then slid to here. He probably farked up the previous corner, and this is the resting spot.
If you extend the line of the scrape marks back from where he came it would be a line that is NOT parallel with the yellow lines - more to the right of the frame than the road lines.
Hope she had very little road rash.
ATGATT for sure - god I'd hate to see my SO hitting the asphalt without the gear. No woman should ever have that happen. It's bad enough I dropped her standing still once!
At least I HOPE that's what I see. I think alikkon nailed it- he clipped an inside corner (rode down it and up/out) bringing the grass with him, and then slid to here. He probably farked up the previous corner, and this is the resting spot.
If you extend the line of the scrape marks back from where he came it would be a line that is NOT parallel with the yellow lines - more to the right of the frame than the road lines.
Hope she had very little road rash.
ATGATT for sure - god I'd hate to see my SO hitting the asphalt without the gear. No woman should ever have that happen. It's bad enough I dropped her standing still once!
mellow yellow
Street Cruiser
I wonder if the local police dept. keeps records of how many bike crashes there are.
I think they are stopped. Those aren't sparks. It's the debris and it's being kicked up by the right exhaust. He is trying to lift the bike. Her leg is under it - pinned. They may have stopped or almost before falling. The skid marks look like they were dragging a floorboard and where it stops is where it fell over. JMO.
norm9688
Crotch Rocket
It really looks to me like they are jumping off the bike. Hard to tell if the marks on the road are from this bike, the bars are straight ahead and i would think they would be turned if the bike was that sideways.
My first 3 laps on the Dragon were in 2-3 gear and low speed to avoid things like this.. :-[ :-\
My first 3 laps on the Dragon were in 2-3 gear and low speed to avoid things like this.. :-[ :-\
Not to try and further a debate (well maybe :
) but doing some close up looking I see this...
These really look like sparks to me, so I say they're caught in the act of falling off.
The man is not touching the bike with his right hand. If he were trying to lift the bike, he'd be using both hands.
Also, the woman has not yet touched the ground with her left hand and yet her arm is tensed and bracing for the impact.
) but doing some close up looking I see this...These really look like sparks to me, so I say they're caught in the act of falling off.
The man is not touching the bike with his right hand. If he were trying to lift the bike, he'd be using both hands.
Also, the woman has not yet touched the ground with her left hand and yet her arm is tensed and bracing for the impact.
Sport rider
Iron Butt
their helmets seem to be doing an excellent job though, even if not FF. :nananana:
I agree looks like mid get off/away from the bike shot. Hopefully she wasn't about to hit her chin on the asphalt too. Gps is still working too. When going through such a technical area I think glimpsing at the upcoming road through the gps has to be secondary or not at all with full attention given to the actual road, especially if you want to wear t shirt when doing it.
Sport rider
Iron Butt
Bob_C_CT said:
I actually find it useful to use my GPS through the twisties. it let's me know the severity of the turns ahead and I adjust my approach based on it. Different folks use the tools differently though, I'm sure.
As for the helmet....just my sarcastic wit.
Wow... is this a term that you learned during your advanced motorcycle safety training?2linby said:
Does it apply to all aspects of motorcycle safety and training? In other words, does someone become an idiot if they ride outside the box doing parking lot training?
Wait, let me go back and read that bold statement, I really didn't get beyond the part I quoted...
Nope, I'm still not clear... is the "responsibility of the risk" or is it the "riding (poorly)" that makes these people deserving of idiot status?
Or is it both!! Maybe that's it... I didn't take the advanced training you and some of the others here have taken, so I'm just not sure when it's appropriate to call someone an idiot.
Hold on... Maybe I'm over-thinking this... Maybe this has nothing to do with actual motorcycle safety that's taught by a motorcycle instructor/mentor. Maybe this is just a personal observation. If that's what that statement was, please accept my apologize. When it comes to motorcycle safety and training, I look to you and the other Instructor here in the forum for guidance. I thought maybe this was an incident I could learn from... But if it's just a ordinary person using an offensive word to describe the people (who he probably knows nothing about) in a picture of the last moments of an unfortunate and probably very painful accident... well, I'll just say no more. I've probably said too much already...
Idiot:
1: usually offensive : a person affected with extreme mental retardation
2: a foolish or stupid person
On the other hand maybe these folks gave thoughtful consideration of the risks involved and made their choices. That their choices may not have been the ones I would have made is not relevant as they don't affect me one way or another. We all have to decide what is right for ourselves and no one else. We also have to live with the consequences of those decisions.
Idiot may be to strong a word maybe one of these will fit better....
Normal -- IQ 85-115
Deficient -- IQ 71-84 (fool?)
Moron -- IQ 51-70
Imbecile -- IQ 26-50
Idiot --- IQ 0-25
Idiot may be to strong a word maybe one of these will fit better....
Normal -- IQ 85-115
Deficient -- IQ 71-84 (fool?)
Moron -- IQ 51-70
Imbecile -- IQ 26-50
Idiot --- IQ 0-25
Let's see if this one has virus problems. (Nice find C'Doc.)
Sport rider
Iron Butt
they were both wearing good boots and jeans. does that upgrade their IQ any? ;D
ChipDoc
Sport Tourer
Thanks for finding another version of the image, Marty! You can see her tensing as she senses what's about to happen. But I just now noticed something else that this fresh perspective shows.
There's an oncoming motorcycle who, if he's not actually across the center line, is mighty darned close to it. It looks as if the Harley pilot may have been trying to avoid a head-on.
I don't think they're idiots; they gambled, just as we all do every day. Unfortunately, this time they lost.
There's an oncoming motorcycle who, if he's not actually across the center line, is mighty darned close to it. It looks as if the Harley pilot may have been trying to avoid a head-on.
I don't think they're idiots; they gambled, just as we all do every day. Unfortunately, this time they lost.
joblo1978
Road Bike
Camper Dave said:
Pretty strong offense to the chosen adjective directed towards someone other than you, geez. Maybe the two on the motorcycle can chime in and go to bat for themselves? Doubt it. We can only assume that you are either related to this people (for which I would apologize for their misfortune) or that you conduct yourself in the same manner. I mean why else would a resonable person take so much offense?
Wikipedia defines an idiot as someone who acts in a self-defeating or significantly counterproductive way. So it really depends on where you look. I would say that choosing to operated a motorcycle with that clothing (especially after this incident occured) to fit the bill.
Would be cool if someone could find a full video. Even with all the additional photos it's still hard to tell what happened. But my first instinct is that there was a bad line with too much speed, bike was overloaded, and rear tire lifted after too much contact with hard parts. Oh and not enough gear.
willyp
Iron Butt
I think Dave's point was that just because someone made a different choice then you, does not make them less intelligent. If that were that case, would you call yourself an idiot for riding a motorcycle, because even with the best gear you still are not as safe as someone in a car?
Nope... I see the words but I don't think you get it...JB said:
I think you feel that the level of personal protection that YOU have chosen is the correct level and should be imposed on everyone. Believe it or not, there are people out there that think you and I are (insert derogation term here) for just riding motorcycles. Is that ok... do you get that too??
Here in FL adults are allowed to be adults and make their own decisions. Helmets are not required for adults.
Whether it be a hardly-ableson, sport-tourer or sport-bike rider we just shake our heads when the news states "rider was not wearing helmet". Most don't call them names, we voted not to be a nanny state in regards to gear and the rider made the decision.
Back on topic, they were wearing lids and the scope of my post in the safety section is only to point out a reason to perhaps wear your gloves. I wasn't dissing them for the gear they had selected.
Whether it be a hardly-ableson, sport-tourer or sport-bike rider we just shake our heads when the news states "rider was not wearing helmet". Most don't call them names, we voted not to be a nanny state in regards to gear and the rider made the decision.
Back on topic, they were wearing lids and the scope of my post in the safety section is only to point out a reason to perhaps wear your gloves. I wasn't dissing them for the gear they had selected.
trikyshooter
Mini Bike
Is that a C14 right saddle bag on the left side of that last picture in the sequence?
willyp
Iron Butt
Steve, it's great that you advocate for better gear, and I think most of us appreciate that you are doing so without being preachy.
The reaction is to the person who used the word idiot in relation to this couple not wearing more gear.
Let's just say it's an opinion, everyone is entitled to have one, and let's let it go at that.
I am glad this couple appears to be relatively unhurt.
Even if they were riding a Harley.
Just kidding, Dave!
)
The reaction is to the person who used the word idiot in relation to this couple not wearing more gear.
Let's just say it's an opinion, everyone is entitled to have one, and let's let it go at that.
I am glad this couple appears to be relatively unhurt.
Even if they were riding a Harley.
Just kidding, Dave!
)
Andrew said:
Good eye Andy, but no cigar, I think it's a Honda ST1300, perhaps w/aftermarket muffler.
.....getting back to gloves
, I'm looking for mesh gloves that have some armor on the thumbs.It seems (from my Google work) not many make gloves with armor/hard points on the thumbs, and I can't find any mesh gloves with the extra thumb protection.
Anyone know of any? (Please don't show me any pirate gloves covered in studs and rivets, thanks.)
Are you willing to bend a bit on the mesh part if they are really protective of your thumbs?
Brian
Brian
fartymarty said:<snip>
.....getting back to gloves
It seems (from my Google work) not many make gloves with armor/hard points on the thumbs, and I can't find any mesh gloves with the extra thumb protection.
Anyone know of any? (Please don't show me any pirate gloves covered in studs and rivets, thanks.)
BDF said:Are you willing to bend a bit on the mesh part if they are really protective of your thumbs?
Brian
fartymarty said:<snip>
.....getting back to gloves
It seems (from my Google work) not many make gloves with armor/hard points on the thumbs, and I can't find any mesh gloves with the extra thumb protection.
Anyone know of any? (Please don't show me any pirate gloves covered in studs and rivets, thanks.)
BDF said:Are you willing to bend a bit on the mesh part if they are really protective of your thumbs?
Brian
:rotflmao:..
........but NO! :96: .....well maybe, I do see some vent holes, do they come in mama Kaw green as well as Honda red? I guess they are apropos for page 3 of this thread or even for the passenger of the bike in the original post, but........no, not what I'm looking for. Thanks anyway Brian, but shouldn't you be off stropping something? On a more serious note, I'm looking for Thumb protection because of a hail storm (reason #214?) I experienced in Wyoming on the way to last year's National. All my gear protected me except my thumbs got hammered and started to go numb (I welcomed that at first until I realized that they quit working as well) finally grabbed my grips from underneath with the thumbs pointed outward like a hitch hiker, where they were shielded behind the grips. I know, it sounds wrong, like why weren't they shielded in the normal position below the grips? I can't answer that, perhaps they were getting hit by bouncing hail coming off the side panels. I was kind of busy at the time keeping the bike vertical and vision was not the best, so I didn't get to analyze what was happening (It was like riding on greasy marbles in the rain and there was only a 12 inch gravel shoulder covered in white hail marbles, so pulling over and stopping wouldn't have helped, it would have been a cold wet painful CDA event.). I just know it was scary and when I moved my hands to underneath it got better. If my past experience is any indication, once my gloves are prepared for hail, I'll never see it again as long as I'm wearing them. That suits me just fine.
So anybody (else) know of any mesh gloves with thumb armor?
fartymarty said:
Step up to the top-shelf KLIM gear, you won't regret it :beerchug:
I use these mesh and they have leather protection for each finger plus cover my wrist: www.klim.com/Motorcycle/Mojave-Pro-Glove.html?whence=
Hey, what a man does with his 'strop' in the privacy of his home is his own business. Besides, there are just some things you do not want to know.
This is a guy unwrapping his new Kanoyama Cordovan Shell strop (and no, that is not me but a guy from Boston): see if you can watch it without laughing
My new strop
Brian
This is a guy unwrapping his new Kanoyama Cordovan Shell strop (and no, that is not me but a guy from Boston): see if you can watch it without laughing
My new strop
Brian
fartymarty said:<snip>
Thanks anyway Brian, but shouldn't you be off stropping something?
<snip>
stevewfl said:fartymarty said:
Step up to the top-shelf KLIM gear, you won't regret it :beerchug:
I use these mesh and they have leather protection for each finger plus cover my wrist: www.klim.com/Motorcycle/Mojave-Pro-Glove.html?whence=
Thanks Steve, but again no. I went on the KLIM factory tour a few days after the hail storm travel and they didn't have anything (even non-mesh at the time) that
would be much better (for the thumbs) than my $30 gloves. Yes, a little leather on the outside would be better than the mesh I currently have on the outside, but
some hard points/armor would be better.
I think that video falls into that category, ...strop fondling videos, well that's just sick, funny, but sick. :BDF said:
;DMaybe you are going at this all wrong Marty- if you like the gloves you have and just need better protection for, ah, a single 'member', maybe you could have some lightweight steel tubes made? In the event of a surprise hail storm, you could quickly slip them over whatever body parts the hail is annoying you most? Maybe with a leather strap to snap them onto your gloves for hail use only? The rest of the time you could just hang them from the bike and tell everyone they are drinking cup holders for Leprechauns? Just thinkin' out loud here. Hey, you are the one looking for anti- hail thumb protectors.... :
Brian
Brian
fartymarty said:
My single 'member' is protected just fine, thank you very much. However Brian, I am most flattered by your interest in it.BDF said:
)Yeah Brian, when you put it that way, it does sound pretty dumb. ??? (although not quite as dumb as strop strap stroking/fondling/worshiping :BDF said:Hey, you are the one looking for anti- hail thumb protectors.... :
]Maybe I'll just cut up some old gloves and sew the pieces over the thumbs of my mesh gloves.
Strop, not strap.
Those strops are sort of legendary, a bit rare and well coveted; he was mocking the aura that surrounds them and mocking all of us that have purchased one 'cause we all probably look like that the day we got ours. ;D The same guy mocking Japanese straight razors: chopstick shave.wmv
By the way: that strop is not leather, it is a material called 'shell' that is found under the hide of a horse's butt and it is not leather nor is it muscle but a material unique to horses. To get all the way back on topic, I cannot imagine a better material to make a pair of riding gloves out of. Sort of like Kidd skin but much, much softer and much tougher. If only the stuff were not made of 'unobtanium'.
Brian
Those strops are sort of legendary, a bit rare and well coveted; he was mocking the aura that surrounds them and mocking all of us that have purchased one 'cause we all probably look like that the day we got ours. ;D The same guy mocking Japanese straight razors: chopstick shave.wmv
By the way: that strop is not leather, it is a material called 'shell' that is found under the hide of a horse's butt and it is not leather nor is it muscle but a material unique to horses. To get all the way back on topic, I cannot imagine a better material to make a pair of riding gloves out of. Sort of like Kidd skin but much, much softer and much tougher. If only the stuff were not made of 'unobtanium'.
Brian
mnofpeace said:
ppenrose
Street Cruiser
When motorcyclists get into accidents and aren't wearing gloves, they often strip the skin right off the bones. The emergency room doctors call this "degloving" and yes, it's as gruesome as it sounds. In my one accident my thin ventilated gloves just came apart, but I was lucky and suffered only minor hand injuries. Now I wear heavy leather gloves with a reinforced palm and knuckle protectors. For the same reason I won't wear mesh jackets. You wouldn't either if you have seen what happens to them when they meet the road at anything other than walking speed.
lucent1123
Scooter
I just wear a heavy pair of deerskin work gloves...... perhaps I should have more armour oriented gloves, but they are thick, and would have to slide a looooong way I would think to shred them. I was not aware of the mesh being that unreliable. I wear a Cortech mesh armored, looks like I need to think of upgrades.
PaulP said:
I can see where mesh wouldn't be as protective as leather, but I think most mesh jackets from name recognizable manufacturers provide protection at levels much
higher than walking speed. Could you elaborate on your experience in this area? Pictures? (yours or web links)
It is possible to sustain life ending injuries even in full racing gear, but to say that mesh gear is only good for walking speed, without further info, is begging for doubt.
Yeah, I know I'm going off topic (gloves) but I just couldn't leave it lying there. I wear mesh gear here in Texas, and if it's only giving me walking speed protection then
I may as well go squid and use T-shirts, as I just don't ride much at walking speed even on the trail 90.
ppenrose
Street Cruiser
Sorry, I don't have any pictures, but I have seen a few accidents where people went down with mesh jackets and it wasn't pretty. The problem is that the mesh does not have any strength. As a result it twists easily and the armor plates move out of position. Then it's just the mesh between your skin and the pavement. I saw the result of a slow speed (15mph) get-off once and it looked like he had been wearing nothing. Now these are the really light, thin mesh jackets, so I don't know how this applies to the heavier ones. But personally I stay away from the mesh. My personal experience with the thinner, ventilated gloves has convinced me to avoid those too.
Hi,
Mesh is fine as long as it is Motoport Kevlar! :great:
http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10919075
Mesh is fine as long as it is Motoport Kevlar! :great:
http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10919075
My two experiences with Fieldsheer mesh has been pretty positive. No where was I abraided by the road where there was mesh coverage. In two accidents, one near highway speed and the other closer to triple digits, the mesh and armor did their job well. Both of those jackets also had some leather on likely "impact" points. One heavy leather and the other perforated leather. The first jacket had little damage at 55 mph and I am still using the Joe Rocket pants I was wearing (a little abraided, but not badly so. Mostly cosmetic). I suffered a cracked pelvis. Second crash I was going a little too fast. Landed on my face and right shoulder with my arm under my torso (which ripped the tissue apart in the shoulder). Jacket is ruined, but no skin damaged beyond severe bruising. I suffered a type 5 right shoulder AC separation and a badly broken right foot. Light gloves were destroyed, but I had only one small raspberry (size of a quarter) on my wrist and a "carpet" type burn on one knee from the blue jeans material.
That's my mesh experience. I certainly would not ride with less than I had on unless some bizarre, emergency type circumstances forced me to do so. Some day... Motoport.
That's my mesh experience. I certainly would not ride with less than I had on unless some bizarre, emergency type circumstances forced me to do so. Some day... Motoport.
ChipDoc
Sport Tourer
I went through an accident while wearing a Firstgear Kilimanjaro Air mesh jacket. That jacket not only did its job, but was relatively unscathed after the incident. Of course I didn't slide on the road surface; just came down like a load of bricks.
Here in Florida (and Texas, and SoCal too) mesh gear is a necessity. I commute an hour and a half each afternoon to get to work and even in the winter it climbs up into the 90s from time to time on the tarmac. In the summer it's a pretty solid bet that it will not drop below 100F at all. Too much heat will drop you surprisingly quickly. I wear mesh to avoid that issue.
Here in Florida (and Texas, and SoCal too) mesh gear is a necessity. I commute an hour and a half each afternoon to get to work and even in the winter it climbs up into the 90s from time to time on the tarmac. In the summer it's a pretty solid bet that it will not drop below 100F at all. Too much heat will drop you surprisingly quickly. I wear mesh to avoid that issue.
racer boy
Road Bike
Lucent1123 said:
Motorcycle gloves have stitching that is also abrasion resistant, and they are designed to not come apart from being abraded. They are also designed to not pull off easily. I'm guessing your work gloves don't have those design features.
There is a reason that motorcycle gloves are more expensive; they are designed for the task at hand (sorry for the pun)!
Motoport kevlar gloves. I wear their kevlar pants. http://www.motoport.com/index.php?option=com_redshop&view=product&pid=23&cid=14&Itemid=15
