Well, I picked up a '95 C10 from a neighbor who was moving and got a killer deal: $1400. Then started the fixing... so far I have: 1) bled and rebuilt the front brake calipers 2) bled the clutch system (almost empty and VERY dirty) 3) changed the engine oil 4) change the shaft-drive lube 5) removed and cleaned out the carbs (full of gunk, and I have never been more angry with rubber in my life) 6) got new tires (the Avon combination with a 110 up front) 7) Checked the air-filter (looks new) 8) Run about 3 tanks with B12 Chemtool (at directed concentration) 9) replaced the battery 10) Drilled out the pilot screw plugs and adjusted them to 2-turns out BUT... There is still some roughness at idle and at low throttle openings and my fuel economy stinks - I filled up while on the centerstand and at 160 miles the gauge is reading empty, although I haven't hit reserve yet. I'm thinking I need to synch the carbs, and here is where the questions start. From here on out I'm on a shoestring budget until my wife gets a job, so keep that in mind.... A) Should I replace the plugs before synching? B) I want to build a carb-synch tool. > Does anybody have directions for building a 4-cylinder version? > What diameter hose do I need to use so that I don't need any adaptors? C) How do you synch the carbs? > Any C10-specific directions on carb-synching? What am I hooking up to and where are the screws I need to adjust? > Any special tools required for getting to the screws on a C10? D) After replacing the carbs there is no play in the throttle grip - it no longer seems to be spring-loaded. > This has to do with the little adjuster nuts for the two throttle cables, right? Which one which way? E) I want to get an in-line fuel filter to prevent carb issues. > Which of the two lines hooked to the petcock needs the filter? What size hose should the filter fit? F) I know the suspension is adjustable, but I don't know what adjusting it DOES, exactly. If I want Connie to feel as sporty as possible (one person riding), what settings should I use? Also, any suggestions of other things to fix/check on a neglected bike... it sat unused with unstabilized fuel for 2 years prior to being adopted by me. Apologies for the bombardment of questions. I'm quite certain they've been asked (and answered) before, but I'm having trouble with the search function. Also... is there a way to search past Concourier articles? From what I've seen they're very well written but it's hard to find what I'm looking for. Any links, guidance, stickies, etc, that you feel are useful for any of my questions will be greatly appreciated.
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Restoring a Neglected '95: A few questions
- Thread starter Daekar
- Start date
Hi Daekar; Congrats on your purchase. Here are a few tips. 1) Join COG and take a look at the library where you will find Chalkdust that has a bunch of articles that will answer many of your questions 
And raise even more LOL 2) Take a look a the technical pages on the main menu. They are not all up yet but the Carb Sync instructions are. (that answers C below) EDIT! Oops the links wrong some burk (Me) linked it to the tie-down page Use this link www.cog-online.org/clubportal/clubstatic.cfm? clubID=1328&pubmenuoptID=29774 (You will have to join the 2 lines above together as this forum SW sucks!) 3) Buy a Clymer manual it's money well spent. The Ma K manual is good too, its just a little more technical. D) There needs to be play in the throttle, cable, the rear is the pull, the front is the return. Try screwing in the rear pull one. Release the rear lock nut screw in until you have some slack then tighten. E) You can use inline filters, I prefer to POR 15 the inside of the tank if its rusty. The larger tube from the petcock is the supply the smaller bore tube is the vacuum line from the carb intake. Likely the Carb is still clogged on the slow running/idle circuit There is a great Article in the Fall? 2006 issue on how to properly clean them. Full COG membership will get you to the article via the library I suggest thou if you do this you buy Steve's jet kit. As it will make a big improvement. http://www.shoodabenengineering.com/Home_Page.html That also includes instructions on how to set the float height correctly. Suggest you buy new Carb Boots from Murph Kits http://www.murphskits.com/catalog/ if yours are stiff that makes the whole process of pulling the carbs much easier! Murph's site comes with a danger to your wallet warning, as its like a candy store of cool farkles for your scoot There are a whole host of things to play with on a new scoot. I recommend Flush the Coolant Grease or better sill service the rear suspension link Change the front fork oil check the head bearing play Check the wheel bearings Check brake pads Check valve clearance (while there replace Exhaust Sprocket with one of Steve's) Most of all the best advice I can give is to meet up with others COG'ers and do some riding its what the dang things for Colin Prior COG IT Director Lake Forest Park WA COG#7767 AMA#1081764 ROK#20000617
And raise even more LOL 2) Take a look a the technical pages on the main menu. They are not all up yet but the Carb Sync instructions are. (that answers C below) EDIT! Oops the links wrong some burk (Me) linked it to the tie-down page Use this link www.cog-online.org/clubportal/clubstatic.cfm? clubID=1328&pubmenuoptID=29774 (You will have to join the 2 lines above together as this forum SW sucks!) 3) Buy a Clymer manual it's money well spent. The Ma K manual is good too, its just a little more technical. D) There needs to be play in the throttle, cable, the rear is the pull, the front is the return. Try screwing in the rear pull one. Release the rear lock nut screw in until you have some slack then tighten. E) You can use inline filters, I prefer to POR 15 the inside of the tank if its rusty. The larger tube from the petcock is the supply the smaller bore tube is the vacuum line from the carb intake. Likely the Carb is still clogged on the slow running/idle circuit There is a great Article in the Fall? 2006 issue on how to properly clean them. Full COG membership will get you to the article via the library I suggest thou if you do this you buy Steve's jet kit. As it will make a big improvement. http://www.shoodabenengineering.com/Home_Page.html That also includes instructions on how to set the float height correctly. Suggest you buy new Carb Boots from Murph Kits http://www.murphskits.com/catalog/ if yours are stiff that makes the whole process of pulling the carbs much easier! Murph's site comes with a danger to your wallet warning, as its like a candy store of cool farkles for your scoot There are a whole host of things to play with on a new scoot. I recommend Flush the Coolant Grease or better sill service the rear suspension link Change the front fork oil check the head bearing play Check the wheel bearings Check brake pads Check valve clearance (while there replace Exhaust Sprocket with one of Steve's) Most of all the best advice I can give is to meet up with others COG'ers and do some riding its what the dang things for Colin Prior COG IT Director Lake Forest Park WA COG#7767 AMA#1081764 ROK#20000617
Since ya were concerned re yer fuel usage...the Conc's fuel gauge shows E even when there's plenty left. When full ya gots ~6 gal main then ~1.5 gal reserve. Use yer trip meters & refill to get an idear wassup. BTW it's very EZ to fix the gauge (see above linx). Join COG & good luck! 01 Conc, Mijami Floriduh OTP 06: http://tinyurl.com/2vk9o2 route map: http://tinyurl.com/4p7pmd
M
millerized
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Guest
In a few short weeks, we're having the Brrr...ride right up the road from you at the Natural Bridge KOA. You manage to get it running and make it up there, we can do your carb sync for ya. I can pack the right stuff, and get your carbs right. If they're ready to go right now. But, I'm thinking there's a bit more needed on the carbs than just a sync, tho. By the description, you're needing a full cleaning of them.They're so full of tiny little passages, it's very easy to miss a few. Not hard to do, just time consuming. By the sounds of your stumble, there are still some plugs somewhere. I'd say if they're off, it could be done in about 2hrs and ready to reinstall. You also can get to the screws while they're off. Figure 4 cans of spray cleaner, the B12 or Gumout big cans and a can of SeaFoam will do the trick. Have everything as ready as you can before the sync. New plugs, wires, good gas (without additives yet) everything as ready as possible. The new rear boots make it much easier to get the carbs in and out, but it can be done without them. It ain't fun, but it can be done. Soft is easy, hard ain't. Replace your fuel hoses before you do any more work on them. If those hoses are more than a few years old, they start falling apart inside, and will plug you up faster than Miller Lite will empty your bowels. There was a few photo's of a homemade carb sync setup using plastic hose and transmission fluid, but I think it was over at the other forum.(concours.org) I bought a Morgan CarbTune, ain't cheap, but does the same job as the hose and tranny fluid...and I can store it in the toolbox...the gold plated well padded toolbox. Seriously, tho. Bring the bike to the Brrr...there will be enough experts there Saturday afternoon that you'd better bring a notebook to write it all in. Also, show up and I'll let you borrow my Kawasaki manual til you get it all back together. Send it back when you're done. http://millerized.com/pegs I'll be in the garage
COG 6425, CDA 111 a through g
Well, thanks for the answers! I'm definitely interested in going to the Brrr ride... in fact, even if I do nothing to improve the bike I could still ride it there the twisty way without any problems... the hesitation and jerking/stumbling is mostly gone, I'm now trying to massage it to perfection. I'm already a member of COG, so no problems there, have my membership card in my wallet. So I need to check out the articles by Chalkdust, can-do. I'll take a look at the technical pages as well... my Clymer manual does a good job most of the time, but then there are steps where it says things like, "remove the carbs," or some other such vague and non-descriptive instruction. Hopefully these will fill in the gaps. I'll definitely re-adjust the throttle cables for some play, doesn't sound that difficult to do as long as I don't have to remove the cables! Inline filter on the large tube from the petcock - got it. No rust in the tank, just want to nip potential problems in the bud. Arrgh, I was hoping I wasn't going to have to remove the carbs again! Oh well, I'll take a look at that article from 2006 and see what's in my future. Hrmmm.... the idea of plugging carbeurator holes for Steve's kit makes me nervous. I'm sure it's fine though, since so many people recommend them. Maybe once I get everything else running and I get some money, I can pick up the carb kit AND the exaust sprocket. Regarding the rear boots, I actually modified them to make it easier from here on out... there was a whole lot of rubber that stuck out into the air box which didn't seem to do anything, so it got cut off during re-assembly. Will DEFINITELY replace the fuel hoses, being sabatoged from within is not very helpful. Yes, the clear plastic hose setup is what I was referring to. Will have to check the other forum. Will head on over to the Brrr thread, hopefully I'll see you all there.
So I need to check out the articles by Chalkdust, can-do. I'll take a look at the technical pages as well... my Clymer manual does a good job most of the time, but then there are steps where it says things like, "remove the carbs," or some other such vague and non-descriptive instruction. Hopefully these will fill in the gaps. I'll definitely re-adjust the throttle cables for some play, doesn't sound that difficult to do as long as I don't have to remove the cables! Inline filter on the large tube from the petcock - got it. No rust in the tank, just want to nip potential problems in the bud. Arrgh, I was hoping I wasn't going to have to remove the carbs again! Oh well, I'll take a look at that article from 2006 and see what's in my future. Hrmmm.... the idea of plugging carbeurator holes for Steve's kit makes me nervous. I'm sure it's fine though, since so many people recommend them. Maybe once I get everything else running and I get some money, I can pick up the carb kit AND the exaust sprocket. Regarding the rear boots, I actually modified them to make it easier from here on out... there was a whole lot of rubber that stuck out into the air box which didn't seem to do anything, so it got cut off during re-assembly. Will DEFINITELY replace the fuel hoses, being sabatoged from within is not very helpful. Yes, the clear plastic hose setup is what I was referring to. Will have to check the other forum. Will head on over to the Brrr thread, hopefully I'll see you all there.
M
millerized
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Guest
uh....that just might be your problem. Mama Kaw put those there for a reason. Not sure what that reason is, but they're pretty specifically designed, and I'm guessing airflow. I'm hoping a sync does what you're looking for. http://millerized.com/pegs I'll be in the garage
+1 Especially if you read SISF (Steve) posts about restricting the airflow into the airbox by 1/4 I'm not saying for sure that's your problem but removing the bell ends is likely not a good idea. The trick with getting the rack in and out is to have soft boots. Here's what I do, takes me about 5 min to remove the rack. leave the boots in place, move the airbox back and tighten the screws to keep it in place. Drain the carbs.. IMPORTANT, as they will leak as you pull and tilt them out! Remove the choke cable from the carbs but leave the throttle cables in place. To Remove the rack fold all the boots down. Pull the rack back then up above the connection tubes to the head then pull the rack out towards the cam chain side #1 pot. once the carbs are out remove the throttle cables. Installation is the reverse. once the rack is back in place, use a blunt large screwdriver to seat the bottom of the boot on the bottom edge of the carb throat. then a coat hanger wire with a 90deg bend well help flip the top part of the boot onto the throat. Remember to tighten the boots, and make sure you connect all the vacuum hoses. If it coughs after its likely you have an air leak Colin Prior COG IT Director Lake Forest Park WA COG#7767 AMA#1081764 ROK#20000617
You might not see any rust when looking thorugh the gas cap but if the bike has been sitting and has been neglected like you say you might want to drain the tank. If you drain the gas via the petcock you will find particles close to that area. If you shake the tank a little to get the rust particles off the bottom of the tank and use a clear tube to siphon out the gas you should see rust in the gas. Make sure you get a good gas filter before using the tank on your freshly cleaned carbs. POR 15 will works great to seal the gas tank and prevents the tank from continuing to rust from the inside out.
M
millerized
Guest
Guest
One of the reasons filter pods never really worked as advertised on the Connie. The stumble you have almost sounds like what I had when I pulled the plastic baffle out of the rear of the airbox. Talk about a dog. It took me quite a while to figure that one out. "Hell, no way giving her MORE air could cause that". Yeah....about that.
Wide open ain't where it's at, and Connie loves being choked down a little bit. Actually, with Steve's jet kit, almost 1/2 of the airbox vent can be shut off with favorable results outside of a narrow RPM band. I'm still more than happy to assist with the sync, and the carb work if you'd like, but I think you'll see almost as much benefit from putting her windpipe back to where it came from. JMO, tho. http://millerized.com/pegs I'll be in the garage
Ah-ha, I'm actually running the gas out of the tank right now, I'll be sure to do some shaking to make sure everything is out. I actually bought a fuel-filter today, but I'm going to procrastinate on installing it until I get my new fuel line (enroute from Murph). I'm certainly not opposed to shutting off part of the airbox vent if less air is what's called for... I just find it hard to believe those little bells actually did anything. I guess I'll find out, if it's not behaving itself after a more thorough cleaning, new plugs, etc, then I'll blow the $50 on new boots. I might take you up on the synch assist, though... hopefully by the time Brrr rolls around I'll have gotten all my ducks in a row. I guess I should make sure my wife hasn't scheduled anything for that weekend... EDIT: Well, is seems my schedule for the Brrr weekend is already occupied by a family visit, so that's out. However, I do have good new regarding the carbs! After running the gas down in the tank I added some B12 Chemtool to the tank so that it was running a significant percentage cleaner, and then ran it until it reached operating temperature , sometimes manipulating the throttle to ensure that the mixture was routed to the restricted fuel circuits. Then I left it to sit. After repeating this several times over the weekend, the problem seems to have cleared up! So, to anybody who has carb issues, the "run it on mostly cleaner and let it sit for a while" tactic DOES work. Now, I'm just waiting very impatiently for my order from Murph's to arrive. I also need to find a replacement screw for the front brake fluid reservoir, since one of the heads stripped, and the other looks like it's turned to cookie dough...
I guess I should make sure my wife hasn't scheduled anything for that weekend... EDIT: Well, is seems my schedule for the Brrr weekend is already occupied by a family visit, so that's out. However, I do have good new regarding the carbs! After running the gas down in the tank I added some B12 Chemtool to the tank so that it was running a significant percentage cleaner, and then ran it until it reached operating temperature , sometimes manipulating the throttle to ensure that the mixture was routed to the restricted fuel circuits. Then I left it to sit. After repeating this several times over the weekend, the problem seems to have cleared up! So, to anybody who has carb issues, the "run it on mostly cleaner and let it sit for a while" tactic DOES work. Now, I'm just waiting very impatiently for my order from Murph's to arrive. I also need to find a replacement screw for the front brake fluid reservoir, since one of the heads stripped, and the other looks like it's turned to cookie dough...