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08 with bar wobble?

T

teleskier

Moped
I have an 08 with PR2's, no cupping on front tire and good tread left on them. Bike has only 14K on it.

I notice that what I think is during deceleration only, I get a wobble in the bars at around 50 mph.  It does not seem to be as pronounced at slower speeds. But don't quote me that its only on deceleration.

I have checked the torque on the bearings in the stem a few times and I can grab a handful of front brake while stationary and push the front end up and down and don't feel any play or looseness.

Any ideas what could be causing this? Tire out of balance a bit? Normal?
 
The two things I would normally look at are the stem bearing and the tire itself. If your sure the stem bearing is set correctly, then it may be a bad tire. You did say it was a PR2 correct?  ;)
 
Teleskier said:
Yes they are PR2's. Do you not feel that improper balance could cause it?
Click to expand...


Hey it wouldn't be the first time. You could try to rebalance the front tire and see if it makes a difference.
 
Ok...tonight I spent a few minutes and rechecked my steering head bearing torque. At first, I tried doing it by feel and set it at 20ft.lbs.. It felt a bit snug but I buttoned things up and went for a ride. Yes, it did not feel right and I still had the bar shake around 50 mph when decelerating so I took it back home and reset the torque to 18 ft.lbs. Drove it again, nice feel to the steering and the shake was no worse than when at 20.

So I guess my next step is the front wheel balance but I don't have the right tools to fit the axle so I have to get those first.

if anyone else wants to chime in, or take your bike out for a ride, get it up to 50 mph, let off the throttle and loose hands and tell me what your bars are doing.

Thanks again.
 
My '10 does that too except around 40mph

it's just a quirk I live with and I don't even notice it unless I take my hands off the bars at 40...
 
I had the same wobble on my 08 after the installation of the PR2s. It turned out that it was the placement of the balance weights. The installer had placed them on the outside edge of the rim. Once I moved them to the center the wobble completely disappeared.
 
Ok..now we might be getting somewhere...thanks for the suggestion on the weights. In fact, mine are on the outside lip of the rim. I will move them tonight and see what happens. I think the shop guy did a lousy job anyway since he had to use 5 of those little boogers rather than playing with the position of the tire on the rim to use less weight.  Thanks.
 
mine does the same thing , after a 1000 miles on the front tire it gets very bad , but when the front tire is new , its all good , this bike eats tires like a fat kid eats cake  :rotflmao:
 
The first PR2 that I installed I ended up running at about 38 psi. A slight wobble developed very soon in the front end. I raised the pressure probably after a few hundred miles but, the damage had already been done, odd wear had begun I guess. The tendencies to wobble/head shake, remained until the tire cupped out to the wear bars and was replaced. The next PR2s were keep above 42psi and did not head shake. They still cupped and wore out prematurely, unlike the PR3s that don't wobble, don't cup and wear very even....
 
I wish I remembered how the bars were when I put the new tires on but I don't. Too old to remember that far back..LOL

I did move the weights and will take her out for a couple hundred mile spin tomorrow to see how she does.  I do tend to run lower air pressures both front and rear, usually 36/38  I have found good wear and traction at those pressures but if the wobble is still there I will bump up  to 42/42 and see what happens.  I hate this process of elimination.
 
How many miles are on your tires.  It is not uncommon to develop a low speed wobble as the tires start to wear.  Some bikes are just worse than others.  Proper head bearing adjustments are very important towards keeping it under control.  Steering wobble can also be caused by the rear tire especially if they feather a lot on the edges.

Other times a bike will not have a wobble until new tires are are installed.  Sometimes you just get a bad one. :eek:  If your tires are getting old sometimes it may not be worth chasing the problem until you get new ones. New tires might just cure it.
 
If the wear to the tire is causing the wobble because of running then to low, you will be stuck with the issue until you put a new front tire on. Raising the pressure after this wobble began didn't help on my front. The wobble didn't get any worse, but not any better either. There is no reason to run less than 42 in both tires, the tires I have run, Michelin PR2 and PR3s, stick to the road well at all temps. The tires for a sport touring ride don't need a bunch of heat in them like a race tire does. The reason for running lower psi is to build heat to run the tire in their designed best temp range....
 
I experienced the same exactly thing and when I started to mention it to the service guy at the dealer her stopped me and finished my description for me to a tee.  Decelerating about 45 mph if I let go of the bars I have a very bad bar wobble.  He said he has heard this from not only Concours owners but Goldwing owners complain about it allot.  Said it was very common problem but offered no real solution. :(
 
My 09 will shake on decel with hands off, starting at about 50 mph and getting worse as I decell, but only with hands off. I have noticed this with more than one bike. My KZ 1100 was bad, BUT when in a long sweeping high speed curve a touch of front brake would start a tank slapper that would not stop until the bike was going straight.Nothing would stop it from doing this.My 350cc and 500cc 3cyl were bad about this and other things but went like stink.Every Kaw I have owned has had some kind of shake and from the 350 cc to the voyager and the 09 I think I have had 9 of them and one 78 750 Honda that I had until last year which never had these kind of things and I put 100,000 miles on it. Is this a Kaw thing?
 
Any bike will head shake, even a car will, if something is bad with suspension and/or tires. A lose steering head, fork clamp, something bent, miss alignment, old/odd tire wear, many possibilities as to the cause. Not a Kawi thing, it's just a thing that can happen to any ride. With everything else good, the first place to look is the front tire. If there is any odd wear, cupping, ect. If the air pressure is run less that 42psi. The solution could be a new tire, prob try something different, brand or model of tire this time. Most importantly never run under 42psi on this big bike.
 
Does your wobble only occur with your hands off the bars when coasting down through about 38mph?  If so, it's pretty much normal, and there isn't a lot you can do to fix it. Some tire brands are more prone to causing this, but I believe it's mainly due to the natural decay of the gyroscopic precession force as the wheel spins down and is also influenced by the rake and trail settings and weight on the front wheel of the particular motorcycle. Many bikes do this, including the C10, FJR, and GoldWing and lots of others.

Pick up any child's top and spin it, and watch what it does when it spins down and enters what is known as the wobble mode. The principle is similar on a spinning front wheel on a steering axes that can rotate at 90 degrees to the spin. It tries to shake the axes it is mounted to. There is a famous study done by Lockheed engineers when the engines on the old Lockheed Electra literally ripped the wings off the aircraft because of this phenomenon when the props entered what they termed the "whirl mode" and this coupled with other factors that acted to reinforce the oscillations.  http://www.ijme.us/cd_06/PDF/ENG%20204-005.pdf

If you pay attention, you may also notice that it seems to be worse when the tires are cold, and goes away as they heat up. I've also noticed that tires with a single center tread groove seem less likely to wobble, but the down side is that those same tires will also be more likely to try to track grooves and tire snakes. My suspicion is that as the tire heats up, it grips the road better, and acts to dampen out the wobble, and for the same reason, tires with a center groove tend to want to track straight ahead more, and act to dampen the wobble. Many things can influence the wobble to make it worse or better by either resisting the wobble or reinforcing it, like a tire out of balance will act to reinforce it. And there are some things you can do to lessen it, but you may never be able to totally get rid of it. Sometimes tightening the steering bearings will help because it will add resistance to the steering that will act to dampen it, but this is not to say that the steering bearings are the cause, and over-tightening them can cause other problems, like a high speed weave, so you have to be real careful doing this.

If the wobble doesn't occur with your hands on the bars, then personally, I wouldn't worry about it. Its the nature of the beast. The standard reply you'll get at the dealer is "don't take both hands off the bars" since to date, no one has ever been able to find a way to absolutely remedy it, (short of mounting a steering damper).
 
Teleskier said:
I have an 08 with PR2's, no cupping on front tire and good tread left on them. Bike has only 14K on it.

I notice that what I think is during deceleration only, I get a wobble in the bars at around 50 mph.  It does not seem to be as pronounced at slower speeds. But don't quote me that its only on deceleration.

I have checked the torque on the bearings in the stem a few times and I can grab a handful of front brake while stationary and push the front end up and down and don't feel any play or looseness.

Any ideas what could be causing this? Tire out of balance a bit? Normal?
Click to expand...

Sounds like it is time for you to try a front PR3. All my issues were with the front PR2 at 36psi. The 3 is so much better at 43psi...
 
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