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FREE POWER (you're gonna like this one!)

S

Steve in sunny Fla

Iron Butt
Industry Vendor
  OK , not going into how I found this -but I think probably every c-10 is going to benefit from doing this mod. Best part, it takes minutes and almost no money. Got your attention yet  :-\

  The issue is a poor ground connection to the ignitor from voltage feedback when the bike is running. It appears to cause low spark energy.

The fix - remove the tape from the wiring harness at the ignitor. The ground is BLACK / YELLOW STRIPE. On the ignitor connector side, leave about 4" of wire coming out of the connector, cut the blk/y and attach another wire, (I used a crimp connector) long enough to reach the battery ground.  Just put a piece of tape over the blk/y wire left  in the harness. I actually just taped the new wire into the harness, and ran it back to the battery.Tthere I attached a crimp on ring connector, and bolted it directly to the battery ground.

  On my bike, I had .31V in the ground line at the ignitor  before the new wire was installed, and .007v afterwards.  The result IMO was a noticeable increase in throttle response. While electrical is my weak point, I have enough knowledge to know low voltage produces poor spark. My feeling here is that the better ground allows the ignitor to send a better signal to the coils, and the result is better spark energy. Or not. Either way, the bike likes it, and to me a ground wire should be just that, and ours are only "sorta" grounded...  :-[

  If anyone does this simple mod, please post up and let's here your experience. Does the bike start or idle better? throttle more responsive? does it feel smoother accelerating? Inquiring mind want to know  ;)  Steve
 
This sounds very similar to the Coil Relay Mod developed for my 1980 Honda Cb900C. In essence, power is lost through the [ancient] ignition harness, resulting in up to a 1 volt drop at the coils. This causes sputtering/poor spark, and cutting out at High-rpms. A long wire wire is run directly from the positive battery terminal to a 30 Amp relay, and then to the coils. The original power for the coils, activated with the key, powers the relay.
I did this mod and it fixed all of my Honda's ignition woes.


Great tip, thanks Steve!  :beerchug:
 
I took a quick look at the ignition wiring diagram, and the igniter does (eventually) ground out
to the battery/engine... by doing Steve's Mod, you are in effect isolating the ground from
a shared ground to the Side Stand Switch, the Lockout Switch, a chassis ground
and a connector that is in line before the Bk/Y wire gets to the actual battery/engine ground.

Sounds like the Connie could use a ground wire kit.....  :)


I'll give it a shot over the weekend and tell you what the butt dyno registers.  Thanks Steve!


 
"YES"!!!    :motonoises:

Hmmmm, me-thinks you might have found the reason that some (stock) Connies run "noticibly" better than others...

Ride safe, Ted
 
Some of us are not as smart as Steve, so I had to go figure out where the igniter was.

I think I found gold.  Here are some pictures for my fellow wanttobe home mechanics.

Additional Note:  Steve brought up a good point in a later post.  I am not pointing at the wire that needs to be cut, or the location where it needs to be cut.  I was holding back the plastic cover to get a picture of the wires.

ConcoursIgniter.jpg


ConcoursIgniterWires.jpg
 
Steve,
Help me (us) with this mod. If you have any photo's to share we would certainly benefit a lot from seeing where these wire cuts & splices are done. Okay Fred-Houston, thanks for pic's!!!
I'm all in for FREE POWER!

Buzz
 
Good pics Fred, just be sure to do the BLK / Y  (black wire with a yellow stripe) not the one you're pointing at  ;)  Steve


Buzz - I'm bad about just getting the job done, and not taking pics.  Maybe it'll find a way into a video - S
 
In other words, don't get the black with yellow striped wire confused with the yellow wire that has a black stripe.  :))

Nice find Steve. But be careful with crimp connectors, they can deteriorate quickly if not installed correctly.
 
I just did mine. I checked the resistance with a meter before and after and I got a big improvement out of this mod and it only took me a few minutes.
 
Steve in Sunny Fla said:
Good pics Fred, just be sure to do the BLK / Y  (black wire with a yellow stripe) not the one you're pointing at  ;)  Steve


Buzz - I'm bad about just getting the job done, and not taking pics.  Maybe it'll find a way into a video - S
Click to expand...

Steve, are you running stick coils?
 
JDM said:
Steve, are you running stick coils?
Click to expand...

Currently yes, but I put them on just prior to finding this ground issue. I tried to run them in the past but had hot starting issues, so I had returned to stock coils. I suspect this grounding issue may have been at the heart of the hot start issue. However I found this ground issue first on another bike with stock coils. I ran the direct ground wire and there was a noticeable improvement in starting, idle and throttle response, so I then went and checked my bike, so this mod isn't just for bikes with stick coils.  I think anyone who takes a meter and checks resistance or voltage on the ignitor ground wire will find the ignitor is poorly grounded. Steve
 
  Great find Steve!  ......Considering voltage drop, ...Do you think an improvement can be found at the positive side ?  Does the Pos. feed directly to the coils ????    .........................Oldspeed
 
Ok, I have to say that this mod  really works.
I waited until my bike was stone cold and right now it is very cold for Daytona.
I  pulled the enricher out and it started right up and then  I  turned the enricher  off  right away.
Normally it would stall out. Instead  the engine idled  at a  very low rpm AND I can turn the throttle. I could never do that before. It would never idle with the enricher off  that soon  and I could never give it gas this soon  without it stumbling.
Impressive.

 
looking at the wire harness, and the fuse capacity, K was scrimping on costs I suspect.  some of the wires seem mighty light for the fuse rating.  no matter, Steve's find will likely help a lot of us C10 owners.  thank you Steve.  right now it's below freezing in my garage so I'm not too inclined to work on the bike, but before spring rolls around and I dewinterize it, i'll add the extra ground.  it certainly can't hurt.  and i'll likely use at least #12 wire.  if your handy with a soldering iron, soldering the connections can help reduce the corrosion open circuits that sometimes occur with crimped connectors.  as I read this post, I thought it might not hurt to ground the ground return wires (add a splice and connectors) to the frame in multiple locations using stuff that bolts into the frame.  the risk there is to get good ground you must have metal to metal, and bare steel (frame) will rust if moisture gets to it.  so I wouldn't be scraping paint or anything, but usually the bolt heads are not painted, so slipping a connector under a bolt head of a bolt that mounts something into the frame should work fine. the coils are step up transformers with a ratio of approximately 2000.  so if your primary field is 1 volt low, your plugs will have about 2000 less volts at the plugs.  in other words, a small increase in the differential voltage  at the coils' inputs (voltage difference between the + and - terminal on the stock coils) has a big difference in voltage at the spark plug.  obvious if one thinks about it, but we rarely (I'm guilty) have time to stop and think things through these days.  again, thanks Steve for taking the time to really measure the ground level.
-Brian
 
Makes electrical sense, not being a PITA, but does this not do away with the safety feature on the side stand cutout, ie if you add a permanent ground, does that not then allow you to drive away with the side stand down?, or am I reading it wrong?
 
Well spotted SISF. just the sort of fix my wallet can accommodate.

Ma Kaw was sparing in the amount of copper used in the C10.

Probably OK when the bikes new and all the connections/joiners are fresh and corrosion free, but as things age......

The actual instantaneous current through the igniter is probably quite peaky. ie it's on then its off. So the voltage drop Steve has measured may only be an average, and therefore the loss may potentially be quite a bit more than a multimeter would measure. Would need to do some testing with a CRO to really see whats happening.

Well spotted.
 
I also considered using the original ground wire that I cut as another point to bolt to the frame. For those considering this mod, you might just want to add that to the list.  Of course you could just connect into the accessory ground pigtail on the rear fender, but I still feel it's best to run a completely separate wire for the ignitor. Steve
 
Steve, is there a reason the Black/Yellow has to be cut off and rerouted, or do you think it could just have another wire grafted in and run to battery ground?  Sort of a redundant system?
 
2Fast said:
Steve, is there a reason the Black/Yellow has to be cut off and rerouted, or do you think it could just have another wire grafted in and run to battery ground?  Sort of a redundant system?
Click to expand...

My concern was that just jumping into the ground wire and going back to the battery would still leave a voltage drop to the ignitor, so I wanted an isolated path. Steve
 
Coming from the left side of the picture, there appears to be first a yellow wire, then a blue wire, then a green/black, then a yellow/ black.    In the picture it would appear from the small view we have that only the fourth wire has yellow and black, is that the correct wire?  I'm just a bit confused as you used the term "black wire with yellow stripe" which has me looking for an almost all black wire as in contrast to the picture (which doesn't show us all the wire) seems to be equal part black and yellow.  Just a minor detail,  Thanks for sharing this with us, do plan to do this but....not till spring!
 
Steve, FYI I made up my stick coils including the wiring harness, installed them on the bike and have been running them for several years without any problems until last fall. I started having hot start issues with the bike. I first thought it was the battery as it was a 8+/- years old. It took me a bit of time to rule out the battery. As it turned out for me, the fix required having to go back and shield the 12 volt side of the stick coil wiring from the stick coil ground side. I shielded the wire using amalgam tape. This seams to have cured my problem. I think what was happening, even though the wires were insulated, they had come in to contact with each other causing some electrical noise thus affecting the igniter ground circuit. The fix you have found is easier than going back and shielding the hot wire and the ground wires from each other. Steve, I would have posted up about this problem I was having and what I did to fix my problem, but I really thought I was the only one who was having this problem. Steve, I will make you a deal. I will report to the site if I start having this problem again and you report to this site if you start having a problem with your fix. P.S. I only had this problem with using the stick coils. I also think if you have stick coils and a weak battery you will have starting problems more so than with OEM coils.       
 
JF, I had the same issue years ago with my stick coils, exact same issue. Shut it off when hot, and it wouldn't restart. When it did, it was when I released the start button. I fixed it by putting the stock coils back on. I have a feeling this ground wire to the ignitor might be the answer, and yes, the stick coils are on right now.

I just spoke with 2fast, he told me that criuse controls exhibit grounding issues when folks have led's. apparently poor grounding has raised it's head previously. Steve
 
2Fast said:
Cool man........this should be interesting. Will this be the three minute mod?????????
Click to expand...

LOL, that's funny! We could call Steve the multi-minuteman (but not from Lexington).

Dan
 
Steve in Sunny Fla said:
JF, I had the same issue years ago with my stick coils, exact same issue. Shut it off when hot, and it wouldn't restart. When it did, it was when I released the start button. I fixed it by putting the stock coils back on. I have a feeling this ground wire to the ignitor might be the answer, and yes, the stick coils are on right now.

I just spoke with 2fast, he told me that cruise controls exhibit grounding issues when folks have led's. apparently poor grounding has raised it's head previously. Steve
Click to expand...

Steve, I assume you meant to say you re-installed the OEM coils on the bike to cure the start problem, but now you are running the stick coils again. Am I understanding this correctly? 
 
kwaksam said:
Makes electrical sense, not being a PITA, but does this not do away with the safety feature on the side stand cutout, ie if you add a permanent ground, does that not then allow you to drive away with the side stand down?, or am I reading it wrong?
Click to expand...
It shouldn't be a problem.  Though the sidestand shares the ground with the ignitor box, you wouldn't interfere with the sidestand's ground path by doing SISF's mod.
 
Steve in Sunny Fla said:
Yup JD, you got it. Steve
Click to expand...

Steve, would you do me a favor and take the 12 volt hot wire and the 12 volt ground from the stick coils and tape them together so they touch each other in a few places and see if the hot starting problem you experienced raises it's ugly head again? Thanks JD 
 
Great! One more thing on the "to do" list for this winter. I'm running stick coils, and have none of the described issues (that I'm aware of), but a little preventative medicine never hurts.
Thanks. Steve, for sharing this great tip.
Cafefill
 
VisionDon,
No. wrong wire. You want the BLACK wire with yellow trace.  (solid black with a thin yellow line on it)
Matt
 
Outback Jon said:
kwaksam said:
Makes electrical sense, not being a PITA, but does this not do away with the safety feature on the side stand cutout, ie if you add a permanent ground, does that not then allow you to drive away with the side stand down?, or am I reading it wrong?
Click to expand...
It shouldn't be a problem.  Though the sidestand shares the ground with the ignitor box, you wouldn't interfere with the sidestand's ground path by doing SISF's mod.
Click to expand...

There are still 3 paths to ground... 

A good idea would be to check where that Bk/Y connects to the engine/chassis to ensure
those ground points are ok...  a lot riding on that Bk/Y wire, even w/o the Igniter.
 
VisionDon Nebr said:
ALL right guys, is anyone going to answer my question, "do I have the correct wire"  pretty please???
Click to expand...

I covered this a while back:

WillyP said:
In other words, don't get the black with yellow striped wire confused with the yellow wire that has a black stripe.
Click to expand...
 
For those of us not that electrically inclined, would love to see a pic of the splice and where the ground is actually placed. I want to do this mod so need it as simplistic as possible.

:-[  >:D

And here I thought every last mod had been discovered on this bike and SISF does it again. The Jedi Master of the C10!  :great:
 
Perfect Timing!!!!

Since the 99 Winter Project is pretty much down to the frame, I can do this within the next couple of weeks.

I promise to document with pictures.

Also, I will tear into the wiring diagram and look for other possible, simple, ground mods.

Thank You for the great find Steve!!!

Stephen

 
Brilliant discovery!

:great:


Started removing the black tape at the connector. Very brittle and came off in pieces. Decided to wait till its a little warmer before continuing. Minus 20 in the garage today. 
 
SiSF does it again!  I'll have the ground mod done later today and try to get it out for a short (and very cold) test run.  While I've not had any problems with my stick coils, more spark is more spark and I'll go to great lengths for throttle response.  Thanks for your input as well, JDM, I'll go back into the coil harness and better isolate the leads for "cleaner" power.  :great:

I love this forum!  :1rij:
 
Ok I'm not electrically inclined so don't judge...But do you run the extention from the 4" of wire coming from the plug to the battery or from the wire going to the plug?
 
Actually, you should probably connect both. If this ground wire is floating above ground, it means everything else on that ground are being deprived of full power, too.

And, this:

Mcfly said:
A good idea would be to check where that Bk/Y connects to the engine/chassis to ensure
those ground points are ok...  a lot riding on that Bk/Y wire, even w/o the Igniter.
Click to expand...

What Steve is really offering is a shortcut to fixing the real problem. The real problem is either that the ground wire isn't so well grounded, or that it is a combination of small wire size and length that chokes the flow of the electricity back to the negative side of the battery.

Adding the extra ground is like adding an extra exit from the freeway, directly to a place where the traffic was going anyway. Sorta.
 
Snowing today so out to the garage ,find volt meter, check out the ground to ignitor!  Meter set on mV reading .060 at connector ground.  Hummm I don't understand why any micro volts at all ???  So I go ahead and do the cut and wire direct to battery.
      Meter now reads .000 mV at connector.
Gotta say that that throttle response seems improved and yes the idle as well.
     
      Keep in mind , the main ground to the engine is UNDER the air box and ground to the wire harness is at the coil mount area under the tank.
      Only two grounding locations,,when these get dirty everything else suffers.

SISF find is icing on the cake !!

        Can someone explain the minute amount of voltage in the negative ground ???                 
 
Apologies Steve, just had a chance to check out the ignition circuit diagram. Now I realise that the safety cut out circuits all work the same way, ie if the stand is down or clutch not in when out of gear, the safety circuits pull the Green/black wire of the ignitor down to ground potential, thus killing the spark, as you say the IC ignitor is permanently connected to ground via the black/yellow wire. Always good to make sure connections are free of corrosion and making proper contact......
 
  Had to go back out and fire up after the mod...I really think she's runnin on combustion instead of compression...........thanks Steve  :great:
 
I did not do the complete mod today - but - took a bunch of pictures that will get you 90% the way there.

The final step of attaching the supplemental ground wire can be performed a couple of different ways.  The 'Tap' style connections are easier for those that may not be comfortable soldering.  The best method of course would be to solder the new wire in place.

First, lets find the Igniter and the wire in question.  The Igniter is mounted on top of the inner rear fender underneath the seat.




From there you can just pull out the connector.




Now is a good time to look at the pins on the Igniter and make sure they are clean.  The Black Wire with Yellow Stripe is connected to the single male pin on the left side in this photo.



This is 'THE WIRE" you are looking for.




The following photos show two different options of 'TAPPING' into the Black/Yellow wire.







This is another option




Again - The preferred method would be to graft (solder) another wire onto the Black/Yellow wire and re-tape well.

The lead going to the battery just needs to be long enough to route cleanly and have a Ring Connector either crimped or soldered in place.

I hope this helps!!!!

Stephen


 
How do you measure the voltage drop (or resistance?) at the Igniter connector?  Do you need to cut the b/y ground wire and measure if there is a voltage across the cut wire?  Does the engine have to be running when you do this? Ignition on?   
 
I just did Daytona Mike's test. start dead cold bike, knock enrichener off right away, apply throttle. My bike did as his did, instant start, idled at 500 w/o enrichener, took throttle. I'm floored. Steve
 
stevedap said:
How do you measure the voltage drop (or resistance?) at the Igniter connector?  Do you need to cut the b/y ground wire and measure if there is a voltage across the cut wire?  Does the engine have to be running when you do this? Ignition on? 
Click to expand...

- just slide the plastic connector protector (kind of orangey) back a bit til you can access the wires. Locate the black wire with yellow tracer, stick red probe from the multimeter in from the back, so the connector is still plugged into the ignitor. connect the black multimeter wire to the battery ground. I set mine to the 2v setting. Start bike, observe engine power being lost in the wiring  :-[  Steve
 
FWIW  - I metered the ground wire  with engine off , I guess the readings would have been much higher while running.  Dedicated / isolation path may be the key.
                               
 
Thank you Smooooth!

By the way (edited June 6th) I have indeed done this, does bike run better, well, it runs very well indeed, I don't think I had enough time on it before doing this to know (plus I also adjusted valves, new plugs, syn carbs) hey, the bike runs great, starts great, I have no complaints.
 
Not wanting to miss out on the free power I went out to the garage to give it a go,but after removing the tool tray I noticed I have a black wire with yellow tracer already going to the negative connection on the battery and it looks to be from the factory. If this is already the case will it make any difference adding another wire? Thanks, Herbie
 
Herbie said:
Not wanting to miss out on the free power I went out to the garage to give it a go,but after removing the tool tray I noticed I have a black wire with yellow tracer already going to the negative connection on the battery and it looks to be from the factory. If this is already the case will it make any difference adding another wire? Thanks, Herbie
Click to expand...

Yes Herbie, the issue is to much resistance in the single connection. Steve
 
Steve in Sunny Fla said:
- just slide the plastic connector protector (kind of orangey) back a bit til you can access the wires. Locate the black wire with yellow tracer, stick red probe from the multimeter in from the back, so the connector is still plugged into the ignitor. connect the black multimeter wire to the battery ground. I set mine to the 2v setting. Start bike, observe engine power being lost in the wiring  :-[  Steve
Click to expand...


Thank you Steve
:beerchug:

 
Thanks Steve, I wasn't sure if this was for certain years of C10 or not, with mine being a 2003 I thought maybe the factory addressed and fixed a problem but I guess not. I will not have a chance again until next week to do this but I will report any findings on it after I make the repair. Thanks for sharing this with us, Herbie
 
Did mine this morning, then went for a quick 150 mile ride.  Totally works!!  Much better throttle response and pulls way better through the rev range.  Great find Steve!!  :great:
 
Don't forget to clean this bullet connector!!!

This is where the Black/Yellow connects to the Negative Post of the battery.



Stephen
 
Going to try this quick mod today, but I'm confused about one minor point. Which of the following is the case:

1. The new ground wire taps INTO the existing black-with-yellow-stripe wire (essentially leaving the original wire intact or by cutting the original wire and joining the three ends);

or

2. The black-with-yellow-stripe wire is cut and I join the new ground wire to the ignitor end of the original wire, then just cap the end of the original wire leading forward into the harness?

I was reading Steve's original post as #2 and the Smoooth's post as #1.

Thanks
Dan
 
I just finished doing the Free Power mod. Without riding the bike the only real thing I can relay is in the initial start up as here in Illinois we have snow and temps around 30. I have not rode the bike in about a month but I start the bike up every week and let it run until it warms up. Normally I put the enrichener fully on and try to start it but it dies until the fourth time then it will stay running. After this mod it started on the first try and stayed running, after reading Steves post I thought I would immediately turn the enrichener off and see what happens and it stayed idling about 500 rpm until it warmed then went to its normal 1100 rpm. I would say it definitely made a difference. My bike has stick coils that I installed about a year ago although I have had no issues with it on the hot starting or anything else I think this is a great find. Thanks again Steve!!  If any one is interested in what I did;  remove the plug from the igniter peel back the tape, take the black with yellow tracer wire and with automatic wire strippers place it on the wire and peel back the coating without cutting the wire then take your new wire and twist it around the B/y wire then put a little solder on it. I used a dab of dielectric grease on the connection then taped it all up, don't forget the igniter plug and put a little dielectric grease on that while your at it. On the battery end I used a ring connector and crimped it on the wire then attached to the battery. As they say easy peasy, took about ten to fifteen minutes. Herbie
 
So the moral of the story is just "T" off of the Black/w yellow stripe and either ground straight to neg. battery post...or find a good grounded bolt to the frame?
 
capmfries said:
So the moral of the story is just "T" off of the Black/w yellow stripe and either ground straight to neg. battery post...or find a good grounded bolt to the frame?
Click to expand...

Yep.... that's it in a nutshell.  I went to my aux fuse panel ground block with 12 ga.  That in turn has an 8 ga. wire to the (-) on the battery.
 
I did the FREE POWER mod yesterday but did not get to ride the bike till today.  I notice starting is quicker, I can back off the enricher quicker, and today it felt very good on my 75 mile ride.  I chose the cut and splice method.  Thanks Steve.
 
Herbie, I'm no so sure starting a bike in cooler temps warming it up without riding it is the best solution. I will not start a bike during the winter unless I can ride it for at least 15 miles. Other wise the bike is not really brought up to operating temp and condensation will occur. As me how I know.  ;)
 
TimR,  Thanks for the heads up, normally what I do is start the bike let it warm and run it through the gears (centerstand down of course) ;D It will run until the engine cooling fan comes on then I shut it off. I do this once a week every week until it is time to ride then I dump the oil and add fresh for the new riding season. Been doin this for a long time with no ill effects. I do understand your concern though, thanks, Herbie
 
Steve, hat's off to you on this one bud. The old Connie is running like a teenager again.  When the temp. gets down in to single digits I will let you know how Ms. Connie likes it. Thanks again JD 
 
Steve, I am amazed at how easy the bike starts and idles after this simple addition. I just keep shaking my head at this. I have two 55 watt ruining lights installed on this bike and when they are on I am usually pulling the volts down to where I worry about running the battery down if I am not at road speed. This afternoon I turned the running lights on and I  was still getting 13.7 volts at the battery at idle, and, when I flipped the lights off, the voltage would come back to 14.4. According to the shop manual the alternator should put out 14.0 volts @ 6000 rpm's. After this simple modification, I am getting better than that at 1200 rpm. Steve, I have been around old motorcycles a long time and I have never seen so much improvement with so little effort! All we have done is doubled up on the ground. Who would have thought it? I wish I was smart enough to figure this one out, but I'm not even close!     
 
2Fast said:
Yeah, we are planning one on Jan 11 up here Doug.......come on up!  :rotflmao:
Click to expand...

[off topic]

I'll change the oil and ride on up, not.

Those Tech sessions at Linda's rawked. I heard  and seen y'all have new digs for it now.

Doug, I think sometime in March, not sure, though.

[/off topic]

I gotta get this mod done.I did a measurement on the ground wires and it comes up zero, but apparently there is something to this.
 
SteveJ. said:
I gotta get this mod done.I did a measurement on the ground wires and it comes up zero, but apparently there is something to this.
Click to expand...
Steve, i got zero too but then i turned the key to the ON position and got 200ohms. WTF???
I think I will start it up right now  :)
 
I had zero resistance in the ground when shut off. zero voltage when shut off. Start bike. .31V from ignitor to battery.

Steve, if you would, check battery voltage at idle before and after doing the wire. I had 12.8 before, and 14.3 afterwards. Checked at the accessory pigtails on the rear fender. Thanks - steve
 
Daytona_Mike said:
SteveJ. said:
I gotta get this mod done.I did a measurement on the ground wires and it comes up zero, but apparently there is something to this.
Click to expand...
Steve, i got zero too but then i turned the key to the ON position and got 200ohms. WTF???
I think I will start it up right now  :)
Click to expand...

Ohms is the wrong thing to be measuring. Never measure ohms on a live circuit.
 
Steve, if you would, check battery voltage at idle before and after doing the wire. I had 12.8 before, and 14.3 afterwards. Checked at the accessory pigtails on the rear fender. Thanks - steve
Click to expand...

I can see where 12.8v would be an issue.

Edited for clarity.
 
I just did some voltage checking. The difference between the blck/yel wire at the igniter and and the neg bat post is about .05v. Obviously, my grounding bar has helped in this regard. This is without tapping into the igniter wire.

I'd call that good to go.

Beer thirty.
 
Sounds like you're good to go Steve. :great: so what voltage is your bike showing at idle?

On another note, I've seen some comments / reponses to this free pwer mod elsewhere on the net, ranging from "should we do this just because he says so" to "Oh, that's childs play. I say this because I did that as a child" to "just clean the ground connection". What they all have in common s that none actually did the mod first. Amazing, you can't even give free stuff to some folks without being ragged on... :-[  Steve
 
From what I read this mod goes a long way towards improving the whole electrical system, I am excited to try it in the spring.

The OEM wiring on my low mileage frame and motor is in pristine condition too - so I look forward to seeing how it helps with a completely stock setup
 
  With the improved spark energy the engine feels  more willing to spin and transitioning through the  gears is more enjoyable .
  This bike continues to bring a smile!........Everyone should do this upgrade .... Its  easy and very effective !!!
 
Sounds like you're good to go Steve. :great: so what voltage is your bike showing at idle?
Click to expand...

13.65-13.70, all accessories off, headlight and standard load on, idle at 1000rpm, indicated.

Merry Christmas down your way.
 
SteveJ. said:
I just did some voltage checking. The difference between the blck/yel wire at the igniter and and the neg bat post is about .05v. Obviously, my grounding bar has helped in this regard. This is without tapping into the igniter wire.

I'd call that good to go.

Beer thirty.
Click to expand...

Looking at the wiring diagram, all the grounds are connected.  It would seem to me that the poor ground to the ignitor is symptomatic if an overall poor ground.  I recently added LED daytime and driving lights to my C10.  The ground under the tank was pretty cruddy and needed to be cleaned.  After seeing that I started to put together a plan for ground bus bar.  As the ground path becomes obstructed, all the systems are going to have to spend more energy pushing the electrons past the obstruction, energy that can't do it's intended job.  It looks like K didn't leave a lot of extra capacity in the system, so there isn't much to lose before it shows in negative results somewhere.  As SteveJ already has a grounding bus bar, he has addressed the deterioration problem that direction.  SISF has addressed it by putting in an addition ground circuit (his amended design) that should not only help the ignitor, but everything as it allows an additional electron path to ground.  Tapping in close to the ignitor rather than somewhere in the system makes sure the ignitor has a clean ground with no other hidden obstructions.

I wonder if using an auxiliary panel like this:

http://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Systems-Blade-Block/dp/B000THQ0CQ/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1387769444&sr=8-4&keywords=12v+marine+fuse+block

designed for fiberglass boats so it has a built in negative bus bar attached directly to the negative battery post with a stout wire would help the whole system.  Route an additional wire to from the chassis grounds to the bus bar and so do for all systems what Steve's mod does for the ignitor.
 
Do you mean like this?  (pic below)  I did this to my Connie back in 2005, when I first got it.  The Blue Sea unit is nice, but rather large and spendy.  It doesn't do anything that you can't do with a $10 Buss brand unit from Napa, which is what I used on the Wee Strom for an aux bus.

 

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i just did this mod today but didn't get to ride it as i had family on way. i cut the wire and ran direct to battery and ran other end of wire to chassis. the bike started and ran just fine. i couldn't really tell if it started better or not as i have not had it started in a week or so and has been COLD! i did throw a meter on it at idle (900 or so rpm).. it wasn't warmed up yet but had 16.9-17.1 volts!

i thought that was pretty high but don't know what it was before cuz i never checked. lookin forward to getting it out for a spin..
 
Tim,
16.9 volts will boil the acid out of the battery and kill it. That is way TOO HIGH!  Anything over 15 volts is detrimental. Typically you want to see more than 13.6 running and less than 15.1.  You mightprobably have a voltage regulator problem.
Matt
 
mattchewn said:
Tim,
16.9 volts will boil the acid out of the battery and kill it. That is way TOO HIGH!  Anything over 15 volts is detrimental. Typically you want to see more than 13.6 running and less than 15.1.  You mightprobably have a voltage regulator problem.
Matt
Click to expand...

so... i have a bad ignition switch and a voltage regulator issue. figures!
 
FYI, I live in northwest Arkansas and this morning the outside temperature is 22.7 degrees on my radio shack thermometer, which mean's it is more like 20 degrees. I went out to start Ms. Connie. She is a cold natured B., so I have been wanting to try this new mod out at cold temperatures. (Under the old set up, I don't think I wouldn't even try it at this temperature.) I go out to the unheated shop, turn on the key, count to 15, pull the enrichener full open, and tap the starter. The bike rolled over about 4 times and hit but did not catch. Tried it again; same thing. Tried it again; it coughed, ran for maybe 10 sec and then died. Tried it again. This time it caught and ran at about 500 rpm for maybe 20 seconds. Then the rpm's jumped up to about 2500 and I started closing the enrichener; the bike sat there and ran steady at 1200+/- rpm's. It took all of maybe 90 seconds for this to happen. Under the old set up, Ms. Connie starts harder than this with the temperature at about 50 degrees. Before this mod, I used to have to run the enrichener at 3500/ 4500 rpm's for more than 60 seconds before she will catch and idle at 1200 rpm's. With this mod I think those days are gone. Another one of the benefits for this mod is the fact that you don't have to hammer on the bike when you are cold starting it because you can start it and drop the rpm's back to idle a lot sooner thus eliminating a lot of wear and tear on the engine when the oil hasn't had a chance to circulate in the system.   
 
Tim said:
mattchewn said:
Tim,
16.9 volts will boil the acid out of the battery and kill it. That is way TOO HIGH!  Anything over 15 volts is detrimental. Typically you want to see more than 13.6 running and less than 15.1.  You mightprobably have a voltage regulator problem.
Matt
Click to expand...

so... i have a bad ignition switch and a voltage regulator issue. figures!
Click to expand...

Tim, if it were me, I would not jump to any conclusions at this time. The voltage regulator grounds through the alternator case and we know this mod has greatly improved the ground system. I would keep an eye on the charging system and see if your voltage regulator drops back to normal float charge after the system has had a chance to recover from starting or from setting awhile. There are a lot of folks installing this mod and if it has any draw backs folks will find it and I am sure Steve would want to know.  So, please, help us test this mod. HTH JD         
 
i am not gonna do anything with it at the moment, i am working on something else. just figured this was a pretty simple mod and wanted to see how it started in cold after doing it. i tried starting it last week when it was pretty cold (20's), no good... wouldn't start. so yesterday figured i would try it, and didn't check voltage before the mod as i wanted engine to be cold.

it was in 30's yesterday but after the mod it started up pretty well. died a couple times but within 30 seconds was idling without choke/enrichener. the week before it didn't even fire a bit, just cranked till battery started to go. now i wish i had checked voltage at battery before mod so i would at least know what difference was.

and i am checking voltage right at battery... if that makes any difference.
 
I went out today before work and checked battery again. With it sitting and not running it showed 15.9 volts! Thought that was odd so checked battery on truck... 15.6 volts!

Apparently my bike is fine and I have a problem with my 20+ year old meter. I have another and will check again when I dig that one up.
 
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