Just another fuel filter thread!

[Jeff.C]

Back in 2021 I picked up my Concourse 14 from a large dealership and it sat in a warehouse since 2013 with 779 miles on it, It was once a demo Police Enforcer built for the City of Myrtle Beach.

It was pretty cool pulling off practically brand new police equipment and selling it on EBay in one day for half the price of the purchase price of my bike.

Only thing I kept were the stickers and used a heat gun to remove them and re-stuck them inside the saddlebags.

Early on this bike was a test bed for ZX14 exhaust cam and throttle bodies, and various exhaust system tests, Drag raced it on Thursday nights running the best 1/4 mile time of 10:27 at over 131 mph with the bags on but empty.

Pulled the cam and throttle bodies and returned it to stock, added an Ivan’s tune, and rode it every day as my commuter and daily driver, logging almost thirty-one thousand miles.

Stick with me to get to the reason for this post……

December I pulled the bike down for a mild Makeover of Powder coating, re-installed the ZX cam and throttle bodies, thinner head gasket, blue-printed the cylinder head on the bench, and set the valve clearance to one-thousandth of each other on the close tolerance scale.

Buttoned it all back up and we put it on the Dyno to write a fuel map.

It Fell on its face starting at 7 grand and went lean in the red, shut it down poured myself and Chris some Southern comfort, and said WTF just happened!

Did I forget to tighten the intake spigots or throttle body clamps? No, I build in steps using a whiteboard and crossing off each step!

Well, the Southern Comfort was working on Chris cause he asked would like to take his Twin Turbo Hallelujah for a ride and maybe shock the ole brain, no thanks!!!

Then it hit me, gotta be that fuel filter,

 

[2andblue]

Then it hit me, gotta be that fuel filter,

So…. What was the result of the fuel filter swap, fix most of the problem?

Definitely seen those fuel filters get real nasty and cause some starvation.

Wayne, Carol & Blue

 

[Jeff.C]

So…. What was the result of the fuel filter swap, fix most of the problem?

Definitely seen those fuel filters get real nasty and cause some starvation.

Wayne, Carol & Blue

Yes it now revs clean and will get back to setting it up, one evening this week!

Me personally it’s the worst I have seen coming from a street driven using supplied chain gasoline.

 

[2andblue]

Yes it now revs clean and will get back to setting it up, one evening this week!

Me personally it’s the worst I have seen coming from a street driven using supplied chain gasoline.

All the socks seem to get very nasty on the C-14’s, is it the style of filter that allows users to see the accumulated junk, or is it the filter’s efficiency at not allowing the gunk into the fuel system - I don’t know - but this is not uncommon.

No wonder the old machines run without a fuel filter would clog up carb jets.

Please post back, Will be good to hear under load the fuel system has been fully restored. This is a good maintenance reminder!

Wayne

 

[Jeff.C]

All the socks seem to get very nasty on the C-14’s, is it the style of filter that allows users to see the accumulated junk, or is it the filter’s efficiency at not allowing the gunk into the fuel system - I don’t know - but this is not uncommon.

No wonder the old machines run without a fuel filter would clog up carb jets.

Please post back, Will be good to hear under load the fuel system has been fully restored. This is a good maintenance reminder!

Wayne

Not only nasty but the filter media lets dirt bleed through and pass dirt, refer to picture IMG_0186 it shows dirt on the inside of the filter.

It was the first start on four cleaned and balance-matched injectors whatever got in downstream, will pass through on the first start, we changed the fuel pump and filter cleaned all the dirt from inside the housing and the screen up at the regulator was dirty, and added a dose of C14 to help it clean the fuel system!

The point trying to make is pushing this aside will cause you fuel issues in your pump and downstream and it is probably a slow degradation.
Change this tiny filter yearly and make it a routine, it is to protect the pump!

jeff

 

[sean97123638]

Hello Jeff. Great to see your hot-rodding posts again !! Bravo !! In any event, I have experience with fuel filter sock replacement on my previous Jap bikes. Yes, you must change them out more often than would be noted in the service manual. I have previously changed the fuel filter sock in my ZG/ZX bikes with low miles and found the filter in poor shape. I recall changing a fuel filter sock in my 06 GSXR sport bike with low miles and it was clogged with all sorts of crud. I then became a fan of changing all the fuel filter socks in my bikes. These bikes had low miles Jeff, nothing over 15,000 miles ! I believe the ethanol also causes accelerated degradation of the filter sock . I try and use recreational fuel now when I fill-up the bikes. Did not get around to installing the exhaust cam/ TB's in the Connie yet. May take that on this year. Inherited a VMAX Gen 1 I'm fixing up. Keep the knowledge coming...Sean

 

[Jeff.C]

Hello Jeff. Great to see your hot-rodding posts again !! Bravo !! In any event, I have experience with fuel filter sock replacement on my previous Jap bikes. Yes, you must change them out more often than would be noted in the service manual. I have previously changed the fuel filter sock in my ZG/ZX bikes with low miles and found the filter in poor shape. I recall changing a fuel filter sock in my 06 GSXR sport bike with low miles and it was clogged with all sorts of crud. I then became a fan of changing all the fuel filter socks in my bikes. These bikes had low miles Jeff, nothing over 15,000 miles ! I believe the ethanol also causes accelerated degradation of the filter sock . I try and use recreational fuel now when I fill-up the bikes. Did not get around to installing the exhaust cam/ TB's in the Connie yet. May take that on this year. Inherited a VMAX Gen 1 I'm fixing up. Keep the knowledge coming...Sean

Hey Sean, That's great advice and something that I will follow, was vaguely familiar with the Concours fuel system being identical to the ZX, the Pump & Injectors are the same. For some reason, I pushed it ( Filter ) out of my head until it was spinning up on the Roller.

Going to guess at the Micron rating maybe more than 200 just enough to keep large bits of sand and grit away from the pump, and yes Sean E10 certainly plays a role in leaving the shiny film and degrading the material when you let the gas phase separate and drys out.

Jumped the gun and replaced the Pump with a new one knowing it was compromised.

What I posted is approximately three years of daily all-weather riding with 98 percent of my fill-ups twice a week at the local Shell or BP, Basically gas is gas without the additive package but my thoughts were sticking to high-end fuel stations for cleaner filtered fuel out of the underground tanks, Guess I was wrong.

Jeff

 

[Jeff.C]

Hello Jeff. Great to see your hot-rodding posts again !! Bravo !! In any event, I have experience with fuel filter sock replacement on my previous Jap bikes. Yes, you must change them out more often than would be noted in the service manual. I have previously changed the fuel filter sock in my ZG/ZX bikes with low miles and found the filter in poor shape. I recall changing a fuel filter sock in my 06 GSXR sport bike with low miles and it was clogged with all sorts of crud. I then became a fan of changing all the fuel filter socks in my bikes. These bikes had low miles Jeff, nothing over 15,000 miles ! I believe the ethanol also causes accelerated degradation of the filter sock . I try and use recreational fuel now when I fill-up the bikes. Did not get around to installing the exhaust cam/ TB's in the Connie yet. May take that on this year. Inherited a VMAX Gen 1 I'm fixing up. Keep the knowledge coming...Sean

The Gen 1 max is a mean straight line bike, I always felt the intake sound and Exhaust sound of the First Gen sounded like a small block Chevy, your going to like modding that tons of upgrades

 

[Freddy]

In reply 5, Jeff.C mentions: the screen up at the regulator .......

That filter is shown in the FSM as item 18.

Fuel Pump and Fuel Filter revisited.

Fuel Pump and Fuel Filter revisited.

zggtr.org

09 C14 wont climb over 5k when under load.

Ive abused the search bar enough on this one. Just picked up an 09 with 144k on the clock. Well loved thats for sure. However at full throttle, power just dies out at 5k. Bike came with the 25 pound service manual. Things I should look for?

forum.concours.org

Suzuki part number 15610-14J00 includes a pressure regulator & O ring and that high pressure filter - which is not sold separately by Kawasaki. It is used is several Suzuki models, including the GSX1300.

Blue City Motorcycles

Blue City Motorcycles

bluecitymotorcycles.com.au

This is looking into the filter housing with the regulator removed, thanks to JustCliff. See reply 19.

Check your fuel filter!!!

Check your fuel filter!!!

zggtr.org

 

[sean97123638]

Hello Jeff. Great to see your posts again ! Last year I was having a hesitancy with my 2012 ZX14R. I was losing power midrange and initially thought bad gas. I had previously changed the filter sock which was partially clogged and just guessed bad gas. I further discovered the ZX14 does not pull code when the fuel pump/filter goes bad. The bike had 12,000 miles. I decided to change the fuel pump and pressure valve out. I installed the quantum pump and components last year, so far so good. The factory replacement was simply wayyy too costly. I do know of issues owners have had with the quantum fuel pump replacement. My tech did advise me to run Walbro. Going to monitor the performance of the bike. I may end up digging into the fuel system again..lol

 

[sean97123638]

In reply 5, Jeff.C mentions: the screen up at the regulator .......

That filter is shown in the FSM as item 18.
View attachment 37896

Fuel Pump and Fuel Filter revisited.

Fuel Pump and Fuel Filter revisited.

zggtr.org

09 C14 wont climb over 5k when under load.

Ive abused the search bar enough on this one. Just picked up an 09 with 144k on the clock. Well loved thats for sure. However at full throttle, power just dies out at 5k. Bike came with the 25 pound service manual. Things I should look for?

forum.concours.org

Suzuki part number 15610-14J00 includes a pressure regulator & O ring and that high pressure filter - which is not sold separately by Kawasaki. It is used is several Suzuki models, including the GSX1300.

Blue City Motorcycles

Blue City Motorcycles

bluecitymotorcycles.com.au

This is looking into the filter housing with the regulator removed, thanks to JustCliff. See reply 19.

Check your fuel filter!!!

Check your fuel filter!!!

zggtr.org

View attachment 37897

Hello Freddy. There are actually two filters in the pump. The fuel filter sock we replace which clogs faster than you think and the fuel pump screen which is inside the pump housing. I believe you can backflush the screen. My tech backflushes the screen anytime he replaces the sock...Sean

 

[Jeff.C]

Hello Jeff. Great to see your posts again ! Last year I was having a hesitancy with my 2012 ZX14R. I was losing power midrange and initially thought bad gas. I had previously changed the filter sock which was partially clogged and just guessed bad gas. I further discovered the ZX14 does not pull code when the fuel pump/filter goes bad. The bike had 12,000 miles. I decided to change the fuel pump and pressure valve out. I installed the quantum pump and components last year, so far so good. The factory replacement was simply wayyy too costly. I do know of issues owners have had with the quantum fuel pump replacement. My tech did advise me to run Walbro. Going to monitor the performance of the bike. I may end up digging into the fuel system again..lol

Hey Sean, it's good to be back from taking a break, my shop was busy with builds.

Could not find anywhere a Fuel filter recommendation in the service manual.

Your choice for Quantum is good and is not a bad pump.

My thoughts are where they get a bad rep on the internet forums is due to spreading information and that multiplies, Bottom line Sean would I use a quantum pump on my race bike? Nope, but I will use it in confidence on my street bike.

Sean glad you got your stuff sorted and know you love twisting the throttle on a ZX 14 cause that buddy is a whole other world, I found that the power is just infinite for a factory mass-produced bike, and hope to meet up with you someday slam back a few beers and talk bikes!

Jeff

 

[sean97123638]

Amen Brother ! Your knowledge is like reading a great novel that never ends...Damm.

 

[Spiderman]

Are all you guys having problem with the fuel filter/screen using ethanol gas?

 

[fartymarty]

Are all you guys having problem with the fuel filter/screen using ethanol gas?

Hey Spidy, ....if by "all you guys", you mean the limited number of people on this specific thread so far....then disregard this post please.

However, if you mean the general membership of C14 owners that are on this forum then the answer is NO.
Not everybody is having this problem. I do run some fuel injector cleaner through mine every spring (month of "spring varies year to year, sometimes July is "Spring"). I didn't start that until after I had reached 60,000 miles though. I'm at 127,000+ miles now and still on the original
fuel filter and pump. I can count on one hand the number of times I've used pure gas.
I am hanging on to all the information about this though, just in case my luck runs out in the future.

 

[Freddy]

I live on the west coast of Australia. All our fuel is imported (from Singapore I believe) and it is dirty. Most of us change the suction filter thingy as a service item, say every 20,000 miles. One time about a decade ago I got just 3000m after replacement. Perhaps a tanker had just dumped a load of fuel in the storage tank and stirred up all the crud in the bottom and l just happened to come along and collect some of it. A friend also had the same experience a few months back. Some of us carry a spare when on long trips.

 

[sean97123638]

Hey Spidy, ....if by "all you guys", you mean the limited number of people on this specific thread so far....then disregard this post please.

However, if you mean the general membership of C14 owners that are on this forum then the answer is NO.
Not everybody is having this problem. I do run some fuel injector cleaner through mine every spring (month of "spring varies year to year, sometimes July is "Spring"). I didn't start that until after I had reached 60,000 miles though. I'm at 127,000+ miles now and still on the original
fuel filter and pump. I can count on one hand the number of times I've used pure gas.
I am hanging on to all the information about this though, just in case my luck runs out in the future.

I will say you are a lucky owner Marty. To have 127,000 miles on the original fuel filter sock and have no performance issues, count yourself a LUCKY Man. Just for the exercise, pull it and see what you think. My educated guess would be it is close to failure....Sean

 

[TireguyfromMA]

Here in northeast, 99% of the only gas available to us has 10% ethanol in it. I've had to change my filter twice in about 20,000 miles? I now keep a spare filter on hand with all my other C14 consumables and I've gotten pretty good at replacing the filter. It always surprises me how black it is when it comes out too. I have three other bikes and fuel filters seem to go forever on those.

 

[LSGiant]

Here in northeast, 99% of the only gas available to us has 10% ethanol in it. I've had to change my filter twice in about 20,000 miles? I now keep a spare filter on hand with all my other C14 consumables and I've gotten pretty good at replacing the filter. It always surprises me how black it is when it comes out too. I have three other bikes and fuel filters seem to go forever on those.

The pump filters turn black almost instantly due to the brush wear. This is true on all my bikes. Are you changing the filter just because of looks or is it a performance issue ? If it is performance I wonder if you don't just need a new pump. Thought is, as soon as you get a little restriction the pump doesn't perform to specification. I have 140K and I am on my third pump. I just buy the pumps off of wrecked bikes on Ebay. It was a big enough pain to get in there so I just changed the pump.

 

[Jeff.C]

Wanted to wait until this filter finished drying to show what accumulated inside, never in my original post have I blamed it on E5-E10 but did agree with Sean about storing a bike with E10 and letting it go bad, in my experience it leaves a shiny yellow hard coating.

Really disagree on blaming it, E10 is here to stay and soon E15. ( If it was that bad as the internet says then why are our nations roads not parking lot clogged with cars ? )

I live along Lake Murray and Pure gas along is sold within a 100 mile radius around the lake.

Starting at around 700 miles and three years it’s been mostly a mixture of Rec 91 and Shell brand 93.

Pump gasoline is dirty, it’s piped across state lines, sharing the same lines as diesel, jet, heating, gasoline. Ethanol is added before delivery by the tanker driver to straight gasoline. You can find all this information on the internet.

Dirty Gasoline

 

[Jeff.C]

The pump filters turn black almost instantly due to the brush wear. This is true on all my bikes. Are you changing the filter just because of looks or is it a performance issue ? If it is performance I wonder if you don't just need a new pump. Thought is, as soon as you get a little restriction the pump doesn't perform to specification. I have 140K and I am on my third pump. I just buy the pumps off of wrecked bikes on Ebay. It was a big enough pain to get in there so I just changed the pump

The pump filters turn black almost instantly due to the brush wear. This is true on all my bikes. Are you changing the filter just because of looks or is it a performance issue ? If it is performance I wonder if you don't just need a new pump. Thought is, as soon as you get a little restriction the pump doesn't perform to specification. I have 140K and I am on my third pump. I just buy the pumps off of wrecked bikes on Ebay. It was a big enough pain to get in there so I just changed the pump.

I can agree to a degree that the filter could contain a small amount of Metal graphite carbon mixture coming from the brushes, but not to the degree of plugging a filter!

 

[Freddy]

These filters do a particularly good job. That's why we don't see m/any vehicles broken down on the roadside. They generally use a hi pressure paper filter with a much courser strainer on the pump inlet. The early ZX14 had different a pump than the ZG with an internal paper filter, before they shared a common pump we have now. Same early ZX & ZG pumps are used in earlier and later injected GSX1300

 

[Jeff.C]

These filters do a particularly good job. That's why we don't see m/any vehicles broken down on the roadside. They generally use a hi pressure paper filter with a much courser strainer on the pump inlet. The early ZX14 had different a pump than the ZG with an internal paper filter, before they shared a common pump we have now. Same early ZX & ZG pumps are used in earlier and later injected GSX1300

The one thing I can't figure out is the choice of the surface area of the filter, which is just so small, then looking at the Module itself and how it hides at the bottom tucked under the plastic.
You're right the GSX1300 Busa uses a better setup

 

[TireguyfromMA]

The pump filters turn black almost instantly due to the brush wear. This is true on all my bikes. Are you changing the filter just because of looks or is it a performance issue ? If it is performance I wonder if you don't just need a new pump. Thought is, as soon as you get a little restriction the pump doesn't perform to specification. I have 140K and I am on my third pump. I just buy the pumps off of wrecked bikes on Ebay. It was a big enough pain to get in there so I just changed the pump.

Oh...I didn't realize the black in the filter was from the brush wear, but that makes sense now. What prompted me to change the filter was a "F1" fuel code ( I think it was F1?) on the dash display while I was riding. The bike was humming along without problem and continued to run without a problem all the way home. Changed the filter and the problem went away for about 2 years?

 

[Freddy]

You're right the GSX1300 Busa uses a better setup.

It was the early ZX, Vulcan and Busa that had the better setup, imo.

ZX, ZG, Vulcan & Busa in more recent models all have this same 'new & improved' pump & filter assembly.

 

[rlievenski4555]

I had to replace my bag filter last summer and just went ahead by doing a full rebuild kit. It seems this will be needed every other season. Will likely hit 30K at the end of this season so can plan to do it during the next valve clearance check.

My pre-season plan this year is to put on new rubber, change the fork oil, change all hydraulic fluids and rebuild the rear brake master cylinder. She is an 09 and I have seen too many threads with sudden rear brake issues due to corrosion and/or bad seals.

 

[Jeff.C]

Glad for the modern invention of cloud storage!!

The original filter has been in use since 2007, Gen 1 Busa was purchased and raced only using VP fuel pumped from drums. The dark residual is dried C12 fuel, that can't be pumped out of the fuel tank during storage.

We can all agree Pump pump-purchased gasoline is dirty!

 

[Konehead34]

Some correct me, but I thought that the intermittent F1 code, was actually a radio rf interference code, that would pop up from time to time dependant on ur location. Like certain radio towers or businesses.

 

[fartymarty]

Some correct me, but I thought that the intermittent F1 code, was actually a radio rf interference code, that would pop up from time to time dependant on ur location. Like certain radio towers or businesses.

https://forum.concours.org/index.php?threads/error-code-f1-with-red-light.15556/#post-177404

 

[sean97123638]

In my opinion, fuel filter sock replacement should be part of periodic maintenance of your C-14. I believe the original engineered design longevity of the factory fuel pumps is supposed to be 100,000 plus miles. Have we seen evidence of clogged filters ? Yes. Will a clogged fuel filter affect performance ? Yes. I do recall watching a video where a Suzuki drag racer bypassed the fuel filter sock on a GSXR and replaced with a more robust filter with minimal fabrication. Just remember a filter is doing it's job. It's not the fault of the filter when it gets clogged...Sean

 

[LSGiant]

Glad for the modern invention of cloud storage!!

The original filter has been in use since 2007, Gen 1 Busa was purchased and raced only using VP fuel pumped from drums. The dark residual is dried C12 fuel, that can't be pumped out of the fuel tank during storage.

We can all agree Pump pump-purchased gasoline is dirty!

How many miles on this pump ?

 

[Jeff.C]

How many miles on this pump

Probably less than ten thousand!

 

[Jeff.C]

Some correct me, but I thought that the intermittent F1 code, was actually a radio rf interference code, that would pop up from time to time dependant on ur location. Like certain radio towers or businesses.

Close to where I live there is a Michelin tire plant, gotta be a 1/4 mile in length, about a half a mile away is an large fenced off area of large power transformers maybe fifteen or more, my concours throws the F1 light, never logs a fault code! Doesn’t even bother me anymore!