uglydog5656
Bicycle
Rev, do you have any pics of your bike in blowthrough config? Not that I would copy your setup.... My engine is stock currently and if I'm going to mess with it, I'm going to mess with it. Just want to see some options.
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turbo pics?
- Thread starter uglydog5656
- Start date
OK, have to admit I've been absent a lot lately. I couldn't go to the National so I've been doing some extreme ocean kayaking and shark fishing fer grins instead of playing with me scooter.Uglydog56 said:
There are a number of old pix on my webshots pages. Hang on and I'll get you a linky.
Maybe a little help in here...
http://good-times.webshots.com/album/562450174oRxoPH (this is just a turbo comparison of the T25 and the GT1549)
http://rides.webshots.com/album/558370844jTlIFG
Even going through all of these old, first iteration pix, one will certainly want to make a LOT of improvements. The plumbing that I currently have would work perfectly for blow-through (and did with a different plenum until I went EFI) and is comprised of a cold tube that has only hose at its two ends to connect to plenum and to turbo.
If you are looking to add a turbo to a Connie I can hook you up with Uncle Bob.
He has plenty of turbo knowledge and has a turbo setup that's ready to go.
I was considering (briefly) going the turbo route, but them picked up ZRX1200 motor at a good price.
In the process I spoke to Uncle Bob about his spare turbo that he has for sale.
PM me if interested.
Colin
He has plenty of turbo knowledge and has a turbo setup that's ready to go.
I was considering (briefly) going the turbo route, but them picked up ZRX1200 motor at a good price.
In the process I spoke to Uncle Bob about his spare turbo that he has for sale.
PM me if interested.
Colin
DO use Uncle Bob as a resource to assist you more than I if he has the time and inclination to help you. Uncle Bob was my primary advisor while building my set-up and he was of tremendous help getting my system generally shaped. However, while he has tons of turbo bike knowledge and is a wonderful tutor and friend (turbo ZX1000 Ninja Drag Bike, numerous ZRX turbos, even turbo DRZ thumper) zero of it is on a Connie. Making it work was one thing and UB helped me with choosing components and general, overall turbo-savvy that made that easier, but as I found, getting it to work under the plastic is an entirely different challenge that caused me to re-build the entire system again... and then again.......... and then again.Colin said:
Yeah, I wonder what we'd be doing if Uncle Bob weren't around? He was the primary tech resource for the ZGRX.
Half way through the project I didn't know whether to hug him or slap him silly. Actually it was hug him or slap myself silly (or both).
I'd probably be riding an FJR or something. How boring would that be?
Dan
Half way through the project I didn't know whether to hug him or slap him silly. Actually it was hug him or slap myself silly (or both).
I'd probably be riding an FJR or something. How boring would that be?
Dan
Dear BAD BOB...smithr-scad said:
No, I don't think you're on my bad list... do I have a bad list? OK, I see the emails... while I did respond initially to the frst one, I failed to come back to it and respond. You really need to learn to save files in various formats. LOL Anyway, I have now responded to both emails. I think you might have gotten upgraded from "NEGLECT" status to full blown "IGNORE" but please don't take it personally. I've just been extrememly busy while at work and avoiding the computer whenever possible when I'm not. However, I apologize again for letting this slip happen. I hope you still love me. :-*
Bergmen said:
UB has been instrumental in MOST of the hot rodding around this place. He gave Steve some ideas as well. He has gobs of Rex data tucked away under his rug and MUCH of that is easily adapted to Connie if not directly applicable. He pointed me to a number of oil pan mods the turbo Rex guys do and I was able to do them to the Connie pan and then give him back a way of eliminating the external oil line loop that all the Rex guys have been using on their pans. THe pics in my webshots archive show ALL of those mods. Having been in PM contact wit dat Ulglydog about this for a while, I've learned he already has turbo knowledge and doesn't need as much help as one might think he does. THere may be little that UB can really help him with that he doesn't already know other than turbo sizing, fuel pump and regulator components, and plenum and pitot tube construction theory. The former stuff I've already given him what I've done and what I've found to work and the latter (plenum/pitot) I've laid out in word descriptions as well. If he goes the route I took, it's a bolt it together deal. If he takes UB's route, there will likely be a bit more tuning involved since it is apples to oranges.
THe reason he asked for the pics I believe, is to establish location of components to point him in a direction. I DO think he wants to do this largely on his own. In any case. My email is presbychuck at hotmail dot com if he or anyone else is particularly interested in doing this. Of course, if your name is Bob Smith I might not respond in a very timely manner. :-[
Rev Ryder said:
I haven't checked your pics out but I've had a wacky-doodle idea about eliminating that pesky oil line loop for awhile now.
Let me bounce this off you and see what you think. First of all, I want to remove the oil cooler from the ZGRX, I think it is overkill since it is not thermostatically controlled. I was going to make my own banjo-fitted hard line to replace the big rubber oil line loop. BUT, it occured to me that all I would really need to do is pull the drive pin from the trochoid drive shaft for the oil cooler rotor in the oil pump and just deactivate that side of the pump. Then I could just plug the holes in the pan and call it a day. Here's a pic:
Or, I could just remove the rotor and chamber altogether + plug oil pan holes.
What do you think?
Dan
Bad as this pic may be, it outlines the most important part of the entire system IMHO... the plenum and pitot tube.
You can see the 2" inlet pipe in the bottom of the main plenum body... and you will see a 1/4" tube running crossways through the center of that. THat is the pitot tube. If I had a pic staring directly into that 2" opening, you would see the tube going through the middle of the air stream and that it has a small hole drilled through the side facing the incoming air. As air goes around this tube, a slight high pressure system is established on the leading side where the hole is. As moving air piles up in the opening of the pitot tube, the pressure there is slightly higher than it is on the leeward side of the tube in the plenum. THere are lines then connected to the two outer ends of the tube which are in turn connected to the vents of the carbs which used to go up those hoses clamped to the frame. THe purpose of the pitot is to ensure pressure differential between the float bowls and the venturis no matter what the boost pressure happens to be at the time. This higher pressure allows the fuel to flow through the jets and into the venturi even when the venturi is seeing high pressures since the pressure in the float bowls will always be slightly higher. It is the most critical piece of tuning in a blow-through carb configuration. Get it right and further tuning is easy and possibly not even necessary. Get it wrong and you will never get the thing tuned. THere is a window or margin of error, but suffice it to say that the location of, diameter of tube, size of hole, length of tube, and volume of plenum, all work together (or against each other) to get that bowl pressure right. Get the pressure right and jetting is straightforward. Get it wrong and you might tune in OK at idle or low throttle and be way off at WOT. Or it may be pretty good at 2psi at WOT and way rich or lean at 8psi at WOT. WHat has to be established is the pressure differential. My first set-up just happened to LUCK into a good setting. My next five tries were all dismal failures. In the end, my last pitot/plenum setup was very similar to the original and did a good job (though the bike was a fuel hog).
You can see the 2" inlet pipe in the bottom of the main plenum body... and you will see a 1/4" tube running crossways through the center of that. THat is the pitot tube. If I had a pic staring directly into that 2" opening, you would see the tube going through the middle of the air stream and that it has a small hole drilled through the side facing the incoming air. As air goes around this tube, a slight high pressure system is established on the leading side where the hole is. As moving air piles up in the opening of the pitot tube, the pressure there is slightly higher than it is on the leeward side of the tube in the plenum. THere are lines then connected to the two outer ends of the tube which are in turn connected to the vents of the carbs which used to go up those hoses clamped to the frame. THe purpose of the pitot is to ensure pressure differential between the float bowls and the venturis no matter what the boost pressure happens to be at the time. This higher pressure allows the fuel to flow through the jets and into the venturi even when the venturi is seeing high pressures since the pressure in the float bowls will always be slightly higher. It is the most critical piece of tuning in a blow-through carb configuration. Get it right and further tuning is easy and possibly not even necessary. Get it wrong and you will never get the thing tuned. THere is a window or margin of error, but suffice it to say that the location of, diameter of tube, size of hole, length of tube, and volume of plenum, all work together (or against each other) to get that bowl pressure right. Get the pressure right and jetting is straightforward. Get it wrong and you might tune in OK at idle or low throttle and be way off at WOT. Or it may be pretty good at 2psi at WOT and way rich or lean at 8psi at WOT. WHat has to be established is the pressure differential. My first set-up just happened to LUCK into a good setting. My next five tries were all dismal failures. In the end, my last pitot/plenum setup was very similar to the original and did a good job (though the bike was a fuel hog).
Here, lemme blow that up a bit. LOL :nananana:
Presbyopia is a terrible disease, but I love the name of it.
Or just use this link to get all my albums. Project ZGT is the turbo buildup pix that I uploaded back when.
http://community.webshots.com/user/RevRider1
Presbyopia is a terrible disease, but I love the name of it.
Rev Ryder said:OK, have to admit I've been absent a lot lately. I couldn't go to the National so I've been doing some extreme ocean kayaking and shark fishing fer grins instead of playing with me scooter.Uglydog56 said:
There are a number of old pix on my webshots pages. Hang on and I'll get you a linky.
Maybe a little help in here...
http://good-times.webshots.com/album/562450174oRxoPH (this is just a turbo comparison of the T25 and the GT1549)
http://rides.webshots.com/album/558370844jTlIFG
Even going through all of these old, first iteration pix, one will certainly want to make a LOT of improvements. The plumbing that I currently have would work perfectly for blow-through (and did with a different plenum until I went EFI) and is comprised of a cold tube that has only hose at its two ends to connect to plenum and to turbo.
Or just use this link to get all my albums. Project ZGT is the turbo buildup pix that I uploaded back when.
http://community.webshots.com/user/RevRider1
And about your idea to disable the second half of the oil pump...
Sure, it would work just fine. Probably give you a little power to boot (not much though I doubt). In the case fo the turbo, I simply made a relief cut inside the pan that routes the oil to the cooler so that it dumps internally. The second side is then used as a scavenge for the turbo while it receives oil from the normal engine supply side. THen you just plug the oil out/in holes in the pan with regular solid bolts. I've thought about commandeering the entire second side to feed AND scavenge the turbo since it is a duplicate pump to the engine pump. I've also thought about re-routing the oil to supplement the first side and in effect making it high volume to prevent starvation in those low RPM emergency deceleration situations that tend to make Connie's light come on. Haven't played with it further though. I'm just not as "inspired" as I was a few years ago I'm afraid. Maybe this winter when the temp drops below "incinerate" I'll spend more time in the new shop.
Sure, it would work just fine. Probably give you a little power to boot (not much though I doubt). In the case fo the turbo, I simply made a relief cut inside the pan that routes the oil to the cooler so that it dumps internally. The second side is then used as a scavenge for the turbo while it receives oil from the normal engine supply side. THen you just plug the oil out/in holes in the pan with regular solid bolts. I've thought about commandeering the entire second side to feed AND scavenge the turbo since it is a duplicate pump to the engine pump. I've also thought about re-routing the oil to supplement the first side and in effect making it high volume to prevent starvation in those low RPM emergency deceleration situations that tend to make Connie's light come on. Haven't played with it further though. I'm just not as "inspired" as I was a few years ago I'm afraid. Maybe this winter when the temp drops below "incinerate" I'll spend more time in the new shop.
Dan, my contribution to turbo Rexs is the cut shown in the lower right orange circle. THis allows the oil to simply exit the pump directly back into the oil pan and to do away with the external lines. The other cuts and mods are compliments of Uncle Bob and the Turbo ZRX guys. And now I've just added a new album to webshots just for this stuff.
Oh. and these mods eliminate the need for using two drain plugs. Only the rear plug need be used again. Also, the sump will now hold more oil for your changing pleasure.
Oh. and these mods eliminate the need for using two drain plugs. Only the rear plug need be used again. Also, the sump will now hold more oil for your changing pleasure.
let me clarify something - uncle Bob DID give me some advise when I asked about doing the zx11 jugs on the the zg1000 engine. His response was "it can't be done". I asked why, and he outlined the differences that would prevent it from being done. Not to take anything away from him, but let's keep in mind that there is some collective talent here in COG also...Steve
Steve in Sunny Fla said:
I can't say i remember that conversation, but looking at the rat bike sitting in my garage, which has been assembled for for several years, it seems I was aware the two engines could be put together without issue for at least that long. I think there might have been a time where I took someone's word that the bore of the cases couldn't accommodate the bigger bore block, but that would have been over 10 years ago, if I had to guess.
Either way, I wasn't shy about the info after I bothered slapping the cylinders into the block, but as fuzzy as my memory is these days, I don't remember it being a surprise at all. I remember fully expecting it to work.
Ryan, you had mentioned about the bore being smaller on the connie case, but the "it can't be done" part was relative to the different shape of the cylinders relative to the concours cylinder head.
The engine has been assembled now for about 30,000 miles with no issues. I have 2 different custom cam grinds now, and I'm running the high lift power grind in the 1109. I've also built a 4-2-1 header that sweeps to the right and stays fully under the plastic. I would say the project was a success.
So are you going to be around for abit and maybe prod some more hotrodders on the old connies? And what are you building now? Steve
The engine has been assembled now for about 30,000 miles with no issues. I have 2 different custom cam grinds now, and I'm running the high lift power grind in the 1109. I've also built a 4-2-1 header that sweeps to the right and stays fully under the plastic. I would say the project was a success.
So are you going to be around for abit and maybe prod some more hotrodders on the old connies? And what are you building now? Steve