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So what's the best brand/model tires for the C10?

dano44

Tricycle
Hey all,

I have a significant air leak in my rear tire.  I have a dealer checking it out now, but suspect that they'll come back with the old "You need to replace the tire" line.  (The rubber is still good, but if it has a hole in it, my understanding is that you don't repair, you only replace.)

So, I believe it currently has an Avon 195 (? - not sure, bike isn't in front of me) on the rear.  I don't ride crazy-hard, don't lay it down nearly sideways in curves, but do like to corner hard sometimes.  Try to avoid riding in the rain, but sometimes, you know, you get caught in the rain.

So, pretty much normal riding, and I want to take some long trips this coming spring/summer. 

I've read the forum on tires, and people seem pretty passionate about which tires are the best.  I'd like to get your opinion on what tires provide the best value and performance.

Thanks guys!

Dano
 

JohnC

Street Cruiser
Dano:

I'm sure by the time this thread has been around a week, you will have at least 10 different tires brands given to you.  As for me, I've run a good number of different tires and there is only one I will NOT buy again, that is the Metzler 880.  Yes, they wear well, handle fair on dry pavement, but when it rains, you have to make an effort to avoid the painted sections of the road as they slip fairly easily on that.  The Avons, they handle well (wet and dry) but don't hold up very long, meaning they wear out rather quickly.  So, just read what each person has to say and try to pick one that suits your riding style.
 

S Smith

Northeast Area Director
Member
My tires of choice right now for the C10 is the Avon Storm 2 Ultra (front) and Azaro (rear). 
 

Tom NWGA

Member
Member
For some extra bucks you can get Avon Venoms. Supposed to wear longer and still hold in the rain.
 

rev ryder

COG Executive Director
Member
SSmith_3184 said:
My tires of choice right now for the C10 is the Avon Storm 2 Ultra (front) and Azaro (rear).
In stock sizes, I concur with this choice of tires.  If you have done any 17" conversions the choices open up... a LOT.  No... actually WAY more than a LOT.  However, the Avons are excellent tires for most conditions and in the stock sizes offer unmatched performance as far as handling and grip are concerned.  They are NOT long life tires, but give outstanding service for as long as they do last.

Now talking about tires lasting a long time... I realize that money doesn't grow on trees and we all want to maximize our bang for the buck, but one thing I keep in mind is that as tires near the end of their lifespan the handling, feel, and performance is compromised, right?  And a long life tire, if you insist on getting the life out of it, will generally keep you on crappy tires for waaaaayyyyy too long for real enjoyment or safety, IMHO.  Just another thought to toss into the equation of shopping for tires. 

I consider tires as maintenance/disposable items rather than as a permanent fixture of the motorcycle.  When they cease giving me what I want, I throw em away and get some that do.  Yeah, I gripe about the expense, but I'm always thrilled with the ride after swapping em out and THAT is what I like... having a ride that performs at 100%, as close to 100% of the time as possible.  Just my .02
 

oldsawfiler

Crotch Rocket
I vote for the BT45s.  On my second rear and the first front is going away.
I do agree with Rev, but personal, I can not use 100% of the bikes potential.  I do not need the sticky short lived Avons.  The
BTs stick better than I can ride and last fairly long.
I will never under any circumstances put the Metzler 880s back on the bike.  That is what was on it when I bought it.  They wear like iron, but they are godawful slick in the wet stuff, or even under hard breaking on dry surfaces.
I dream of 17" wheels :'(
 

mrandol

Guest
Guest
dano44 said:
So, I believe it currently has an Avon 195 (? - not sure, bike isn't in front of me) on the rear.  I don't ride crazy-hard, don't lay it down nearly sideways in curves, but do like to corner hard sometimes.  Try to avoid riding in the rain, but sometimes, you know, you get caught in the rain.

I've read the forum on tires, and people seem pretty passionate about which tires are the best.  I'd like to get your opinion on what tires provide the best value and performance.

Asking what tires are best is like asking who's the prettiest girl.  You'll get folks asking why you think that even matters in the choice :)

I've been mostly happy with the Avons.  I don't do much mileage tho', so relatively fast wear isn't an issue.  If they wore longer I'd probably have to replace them from dry rot anyway.  Most of my seat time is at 20-40MPH herding bicycles or commuting.  Which come to think of it most of that is at the same speed.

I can get the rear to slip around here, but Austin's streets are paved with reclaimed fryer grease and BBQ drippin's. 

Know you were looking for a 'best', but the Tire List is over here.  I'm linking the front page instead of the link since I'm not certain it will remain constant as I edit the 'front page'.  Go through the ToC and you'll get there.  It's a bare bone page so it ought to load quickly.
http://web.newsguy.com/vrooomm/Connie/
 

suzukijay

Mini Bike
If you are using the stock rims the Dunlop Roadsmart radial tire is a very good choice for a front tire.  Right now mine has 16k on it and still isn't down to the wear marks...yet. 

Dunlop D205's rear tires are still available and do very good in the rain.

 

Cap'n Bob

I Need a Life
GSGSXJay said:
If you are using the stock rims the Dunlop Roadsmart radial tire is a very good choice for a front tire.  Right now mine has 16k on it and still isn't down to the wear marks...yet. 

Dunlop D205's rear tires are still available and do very good in the rain.


I've never liked the Dunlop's as much. They always give me the flat squared off edge feel, much quicker than other tires! But that's just my experience.
 

rev ryder

COG Executive Director
Member
I'm a Dunflop hater hater hater (yeah, that bad).  But now that I have 17" rims and can run any tire I want... I've got a set of Roadsmarts on there and I like em a lot.  Hated the 205s though... hate hate hate.  Sorry, cuppin', squarin'-off, no stickin', so and sos.  :mad:

There, I feel better now.  ;)
They were MUCH better than the OEM rubber.
 

suzukijay

Mini Bike
Rev Rider said:
I'm a Dunflop hater hater hater (yeah, that bad).  But now that I have 17" rims and can run any tire I want... I've got a set of Roadsmarts on there and I like em a lot.  Hated the 205s though... hate hate hate.  Sorry, cuppin', squarin'-off, no stickin', so and sos.  :mad:

There, I feel better now.  ;)
They were MUCH better than the OEM rubber.
The Dunlop RoadSmart front tire is much better than the Dunlop D205 front tire because of the multiple compound tread.  Too bad Dunlop hasn't made a RoadSmart tire in 150/80-16.  :(

If the manufacturers decide to quit making the C10 sized tires in the near future I'm going to make a beeline to get 17" rims OR get another bike. 
 

suzukijay

Mini Bike
Mr.Moose said:
I was wondering if anyone had experience with the Shinko 747's?
Can't say that I have personal experience w/ that tire but a friend has been happy w/ Shinko Raven tires.  The best thing about them was the price but in the same breath there have been problems w/ quality.
 

rev ryder

COG Executive Director
Member
$261.93 with FREE shipping to lower 48 from www.americanmototire.com that's the Ultra 2 Storm in the 110 size and Azaro rear in 150.

$249.90 from www.swmototires.com for the same sizes.  Also FREE shippping

hope this helps.
 

norm9688

Crotch Rocket
Rev Rider said:
$261.93 with FREE shipping to lower 48 from www.americanmototire.com that's the Ultra 2 Storm in the 110 size and Azaro rear in 150.

$249.90 from www.swmototires.com for the same sizes.  Also FREE shippping

hope this helps.

Rev, I was looking around and it looks like the Avon Venom are available in stock sizes, do you know if anyone has tried them?
 

Tom NWGA

Member
Member
I've got the Venoms in 'Goldwing' sizes on mine (f 130/70-18, r 160/80-16). So far, 3K miles and loving it.
 

denneyr

Moped
I ordered a Storm 2 front tire in 120/70 - 18 from swmototires.com.  Best price I found anywhere and free shipping.  Thanks for all the info from everyone.  I will order the rear Avon AV46 from swmototires.com when it is time to replace my Dunlop D205 rear.

2000 Concours 43k
 

rev ryder

COG Executive Director
Member
I have no Venom experience.  Storm, Azaro, D205, OEM,Macadam X100, Pilot Road, Pilot Power, Pirelli Sport Demons, and now Roadsmarts in 17".  I've run these tires only on the C10.
 

slybonesjesse

Sport Tourer
So Rev, how do you get 250 for the Avon combo at swmototires. When I look the front is 128 and the rear 140. Thats 268 by my math.

I noticed shopping for BT45 they were cheaper at MS superstore.

BT45's which some like better are 86 front and 116 rear for $202 shipped from MS Superstore. So far I like the BT-45's. Similar to the Avon combo from a wear point of view with the front wearing well, and the back is going much quicker. Had me thinking of going back to Pig Wing tars again and trying the Venoms. However I see the Venoms are $307 for a set shipped at MS superstore in wing sizes and for a comparison from the same store the BT45's would be $318 for a front and 2 rears.  Comparing them from the same store, seems like not to far off cost wise. On one side its a bit less work to not change the extra rear for wing size. But on the other side I can keep the nice handling of the 110/80 front, the grip, etc of the sport tour tire in stock size for $11 in cost. Its really only a bit more time in Colin's garage.

 

rev ryder

COG Executive Director
Member
Like I stated, that was for the 110/80-18 front tire (we guys with early bikes has skinny front rims hence a smaller tire that runs $109.95) and the 150/60-16 rear (same all models @ $139.95) for a total of $149.90 + free shipping.  As would be expected, you priced the later model 120 front at $119.95.  Sorry to get you all excited.  ;D


EDIT TO ADD:
Wait a minute.  Your numbers are still fuzzy.  Where did you get $128 for the front at?
(lookin around some more)
Ahhh, OK.  I see you were looking at the Storm 2.  I was looking at the original Storm front tire.
 

norm9688

Crotch Rocket
Slybones said:
So Rev, how do you get 250 for the Avon combo at swmototires. When I look the front is 128 and the rear 140. Thats 268 by my math.

I noticed shopping for BT45 they were cheaper at MS superstore.

BT45's which some like better are 86 front and 116 rear for $202 shipped from MS Superstore. So far I like the BT-45's. Similar to the Avon combo from a wear point of view with the front wearing well, and the back is going much quicker. Had me thinking of going back to Pig Wing tars again and trying the Venoms. However I see the Venoms are $307 for a set shipped at MS superstore in wing sizes and for a comparison from the same store the BT45's would be $318 for a front and 2 rears.  Comparing them from the same store, seems like not to far off cost wise. On one side its a bit less work to not change the extra rear for wing size. But on the other side I can keep the nice handling of the 110/80 front, the grip, etc of the sport tour tire in stock size for $11 in cost. Its really only a bit more time in Colin's garage.

Sw moto seems to have the Venom in  near stock sizes, 120/80/18 front and 150/80/16 rear for about $275.00 shipped.
 

brady

Moped
could someone explain to me what the biggest differences are between the Avon storm/azaro combo and the BT45's other then $75.
 

norm9688

Crotch Rocket
Brady said:
could someone explain to me what the biggest differences are between the Avon storm/azaro combo and the BT45's other then $75.

The Avons are radial tires and the BT45's are Bias-ply. The BT45's will last longer but the Avons will give you better grip at the limits. Many feel that radials give a quicker response to inputs over bias-ply tires. It all breaks down to how and where you ride and what you would like for tire life. Most seem to average about 6000 miles from the rear on the Avons while I think the BT45's could give you 10k or more.
 

slybonesjesse

Sport Tourer
Having done radials D205's and BT45's back to back, I saw no change in the response of the tire.  There are a few on this forum who have done the Avons and BT45 back to back.  I don't think handling response is an issue.

All in all the trade off are probably true, but at a very small scale. When it comes to the balance of handling and traction versus tire life, the  BT45 are a lot more like the Avons and a lot less like the difference when comparing Avons / D205's / or BT45s to the Wing Size tires.

I have 8K on my rear now and its getting low and starting to square off.  10K will be lucky. The front seems to be doing good. And the other I know that have used BT45 report similar things. -- Why I priced 2 rears and 1 front  for the comparison.
 

slybonesjesse

Sport Tourer
norm9688 said:
Sw moto seems to have the Venom in  near stock sizes, 120/80/18 front and 150/80/16 rear for about $275.00 shipped.

Maybe but then my statement was Venoms in the wing sizes are $307 shipped at MS Superstore. Looking at swmototire wing size Venoms are 139 for the front and 171 for the rear, at $310 shipped.

There are people who have always been disappointed in the lack of mileage of the performance oriented tires. Me included. People have looked to the Wing Size tires as a way to get more of a balance between tire life and performance.  Some wing tires like the ME880's and the Elite 3's are pretty touring oriented. The gap between the performance tires and the wing tires was noticeable.

But then we got the Pilot GT's which handled way better than the previous wing tires most have tried. And we had a guy selling them to us for $260 range shipped.  The gap narrowed. At the time it seemed Avons versus Pilot GT's was all talk. At roughly $260 shipped for either set. -- I ran both the ME880s and the Pilot GTs.

Now days the Pilot GT's are gone and Avon Venoms are the replacement for the Wing Size group.  And people have also found some excellent alternatives in the stock sizes. While Avon Storm/Azaro combo may still be the best all out tire combo, there are some alternatives in the stock sizes with a very close gap, and nothing like the switch to Wing Sizes. BT45's being one of them. And at $70 range cheaper. There are even at least 2 on this forum that have done both the Avons and the BT45's and like the BT45's better.

We have also learned the 120/70 front tires don't belong on our bikes as they are designed for a 3.5" wheel and not the Connie's 3.0" wheel. We have learned to get the 110/80 instead.

So now my BT45 rear is getting down there and its time for me to think about what to try next. Do I want to go back to wing sizes and try the Venoms or should I stick with the BT45's. Or how about I finally get off my butt and try some Avons.

When I factor in cost, 2 rears and 1 front for Avons is a bit more than a set of Venoms in the wing sizes. But for the BT45's 2 rears and 1 front versus a set of Venoms in the wing size is only $11. Now I am wondering if I can stick with a performance oriented tire and get the mileage of the wing tires for similar cost, albeit more time in the garage changing that rear.

On edit, I got 20K out of my Pilot GT's and ME880's. However I dont seem to be as hard one tires as some. 15K is/was average for the Pilot GT crowd. I don't know about the Venoms. Anyway using 15K as a benchmark, and the wear on my current BT45's the question is can I get 15K out of 2 BT45 rears and 1 front. I say easily out of 2 rears. Not sure about the front. 15K on the BT front might be pushing it. -- But then I got the V rated BT45 front. They also have a H rated BT45 front that fits the Connie. In our sizes the BT45 rear is V rated only. But for the front an H rated BT45 might do the trick. -- Given the Wing sizes tires are all H rated ( that I know of ) this is not a big loss in my comparison of sticking with performance tires and mileage versus switching back to wing sizes.
 

norm9688

Crotch Rocket
Slybones said:
On edit, I got 20K out of my Pilot GT's and ME880's. However I dont seem to be as hard one tires as some. 15K is/was average for the Pilot GT crowd. I don't know about the Venoms. Anyway using 15K as a benchmark, and the wear on my current BT45's the question is can I get 15K out of 2 BT45 rears and 1 front. I say easily out of 2 rears. Not sure about the front. 15K on the BT front might be pushing it. -- But then I got the V rated BT45 front. They also have a H rated BT45 front that fits the Connie. In our sizes the BT45 rear is V rated only. But for the front an H rated BT45 might do the trick. -- Given the Wing sizes tires are all H rated ( that I know of ) this is not a big loss in my comparison of sticking with performance tires and mileage versus switching back to wing sizes.

I'm getting near 14k on my Pilot Gt's and need to find something to replace or do the 17in rear converson. In the BT45's they list a 110/80/18 front and a 150/80/16 rear so why get "wing" size? Do you think the 110/80/18 front will fit a 2003?
 

slybonesjesse

Sport Tourer
The 110/80-18 fits great on my 2003. Don't see why it will not fit on yours.

The stock Dunlop K700 series tires are radials and the 120/70 is designed for the 3.0" front wheel the Connie has.

However if you check the websites D205's, Avons and other tires in the 120/70 size are designed for 3.5" wheels, with 3.5" being the minimum width allowed and 3.75 being the widest. Of course most people dont know this and install them anyways. The 110/80 tires are 2.5" minimum wheel width ( the stock wheel in the older Connies ) and 3.0" wheel is the max width, the newer Connies. They will fit both.

Once many moons ago I think it was Colt45 who said the 120 deform enough that they were not any wider than the 110 when mounted. According to the tire size calculators the 120 is supposed to be 4.72 inches wide. The 110 is supposed to be 4.33 inches wide.

I measured my D205 120/70 radial at 4.45 inches mounted on my wheel. That's .27 inches deformation when mounted. Later when I removed the D205 and installed the BT45's I measured the unmounted D205 at 4.72 inches.

On the other hand the 110/80 is supposed to be 4.33 inches. My BT45 110/80 measured 4.33 both before and after mounting. No change in shape what so ever.

Here is my calipers set at 4.72 inches and then held up to the horribly cupped D205 about to be replaced. As you can see there is quite a gap there.

IMGP5355.JPG
 

brady

Moped
is there any difference between the avon storm and storm 2?  Also are radials any safer then bias tires? Slybones how are the BT45's in the wet?
 

slybonesjesse

Sport Tourer
From a tire diameter point of view

120/70 should be 24.61 inches
110/80 should be 24.93 inches
130/70 should be 25.17 inches

Given this I was expecting some change in speedometer and odometer readings when switching from the D205's to the BT45's. However it didn't work out like that. I did not measure tire diameter like I did the width. But I suspect that squishing the 120 on the to narrow 3.0" wheel not only deformed it width wise, but also height wise as well.

If you read my older posts and my Connie website pages you'll see that I always felt the D205's were a bit nervous feeling. Yes they steer quicker that the wing sizes I was running before. They had a smoother, nicer ride as well. Yes even compared to the Pilot GT's, which I liked very much. However I always felt like I had to make constant minute corrections all the time. They just had a twitch to them I never got used to, especially after 40K of wing size tires. And the D205 front cupped horribly just like every one complains about them. To me they were also noisy. Up straight they were quiet, but howled in the turns. And got worse as they got older and cupped.

Now with the BT45's, they steer and ride just as nice as the D205's did. Nicer than either of the wing sizes I tried. And they don't have that nervous feeling. From that point of view I noticed no real change in steering and response. Just that nervous feeling went away. These track straight, ride nice, excellent traction, steer nice and light, etc etc. They are quiet too. No ####ing howling, thank you!! I am happy as can be with these. Now if I could only get 15K out of a set.
 

Tom NWGA

Member
Member
Moderator, can we make this thread a sticky one? There is lots of good information that will be needed again, for sure.  Thanks.
 

boatnut

Tricycle
I've been running Metzeler ME 880 bias plys for the last 16k Kms and still have at least one more season on them. They handle well and stick well, although I'm not the most agressive rider around ( top speed so far only 205 Kms/hr ). They are not recomended for connie as they have a top rated speed of 230Kms/hr but I won't exceed that so I figure they are O.K. for me. By the way most of my riding is two up with gear ( often my wife and our 50lb airdale dog ). Good hunting, Greg- 01 zg1000 60k Kms.
 

oldsawfiler

Crotch Rocket
Greg, I had the 880s on mine when I bought it and though they were pretty good.  I couldn't understand why people were downing them so much.  When I replaced them with the Bridgstone 45vs, I found out why.  The 880s wear like iron, but they really don't stick very well.
Have you tried any other tires on your concours yet?
 

Gary_T

Member
Member
I've had stock tires and replaced them with Metzlers on both of the connie's I've owned.  I've been in quite a bit of rain, and haven't had any grip problems, other than once hitting a dew-laden relective tape strip at a stop light with too much speed.  I'm getting about 18K miles on a rear tire and 20K on the front.  I do very little of my own wrenching, and changing tires every 6K miles would be quite an expense and a hassle.  I think I had just bought my first pair of 880's when the Pilot GT's came out, and by the time I wore them out, the GT's were gone! 

I find the wing size 880's wear well, they track well, add an inch or so to the bike height (which even trues the speedometer!).  Most of my riding is either commuting to work, or backroad riding and blasting home/ blasting there and riding back.  Even the two or three long trips I take each year have at least one blast leg on the interstate, which is what these tires were designed for.  I've been to the Dragon/Blue Ridge/Cherahola twice on 'em, but I'm not a very agressive rider and don't realize any deficit to the handling.

So like the smart people on this site have already said, there is no optimum tire for the connie, just optimum tires for the way you ride. 
 

denneyr

Moped
After reading all the info on the forum I decided to go with the Avon Storm 2 Ultra in the 120/70ZR-18 in the front.  I had it installed today and the handling improvement from the Dunlop 205 in the 110/80R-18 was immediately noticeable.

I plan to put the Avon Azaro ST AV46 on the rear when the Dunlop 205 is worn down.
 

Ranger Jim

Member
Member
I've run stock Dunlops (only got about 6K miles/set), ME880's (wear like iron, wet handling is less than stellar), Pilot GT (had a great balance between handling wet or dry and tire wear, unfortunately no longer in production) and currently have the Avon Azaro/Storm combination (seems a bit "nervous" on the slab but handling wet or dry is excellent, tire mileage TBD).
 

brady

Moped
ya its a really bummer that the Pilot GT's are no longer produced. I'm very happy how they have worn and would have bought another set if they had been available.
 
M

mjrfd99

Guest
Guest
My GT's are done.  Would like to try the BT-45.  Where to get a deal and what size do you suggest for my 05?

PS Very disapointed that my front GT devloped a 6 in bulge on tread. 1/2 the tire left but now worthless.
 

slybonesjesse

Sport Tourer
Back a while ago, my Pilot GT front did the same thing. There have been others too. We are not alone. At the time I posted about mine someone had  a link to a recall by Michelin for a different series Pilot tire, but had the same/similar failure mode as we are seeing on the Pilot GT's.  I used to have a pic of it posted but I must have deleted from my site as its now a red X.

 
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